View Poll Results: Which starter would you use?

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  • Chespin

    845 26.83%
  • Fennekin

    1,329 42.19%
  • Froakie

    849 26.95%
  • NONE, Dunsparce looks better

    127 4.03%
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Thread: Starter Speculation/Discussion Thread

  1. #9351
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    Quote Originally Posted by MidnightFennekin View Post
    Garchomp: Big Claws= Poison Jab

    Altaria: Dragons Breath Fire=Flamethrower

    Dragonite: Thunderbolt=Dragonair seems to have some kinda control ever weather. (I believe it can learn all four weather changing moves.)

    Haxorus: Nearly every thing and it's mother can learn this. It's how I got past Wake on a Chimchar/Monferno/Infernape solo run.

    Flygon-Based on Insect-Insects suck and drain things.

    Any Pokemon can have wide movepools, it's mostly based on their design, not type.
    Boom. That's why dragon starters will be op. It's because they're dragons. And dragons breath fire! Besides, the Gamefreak people have been known to slap huge TM movepools on dragon types, because they're dragon types.

    I honestly don't see the necessity for a dragon starter. It's just unnecessary and too overpowered. Unless you're suggesting every trainer and their mothers carry ice beam and dragon pulse everywhere they go. I personally think that they won't go down that route, it just gives the specific starter too much advantage over another.

    As for the movepool thing, having to learn a particular move just to counter the starter you are weak against is just... bad and annoying. That means your mon will lack diversity. So every run you'll have to carry Ice Beam or Dragon Pulse. But wait! What if Ice Beam was found like at 7th gym? Boom!

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  2. #9352
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    Quote Originally Posted by cascadethewarrior View Post
    Not really, it would have just as much chance as the other starters. Each starters has it's advantage and disadvantage compared to the other. This would be no different. For example, in Johto Chikorita has a disadvantage for the first 2 gyms compared to choosing Cyndaquil and Tododile.
    Chance for what? I don't get where this disadvantage thing is coming into this? I was talking about advantages it would have over a lot of other Pokemon. It'll pretty much make them have to re-arrange the game just so this part dragon starter doesn't have so many advantages.

    The fact is dragon is easily the best offensive type in the game and to pair it with a grass/water/fire Pokemon which are also other very effective types give it some ridiculous features for a starter Pokemon.






    ...What? They learn the moves they learn because those moves are in their move pool not because they're Dragon-type...[/QUOTE]

    Quote Originally Posted by MidnightFennekin View Post
    Garchomp: Big Claws= Poison Jab

    Altaria: Dragons Breath Fire=Flamethrower

    Dragonite: Thunderbolt=Dragonair seems to have some kinda control ever weather. (I believe it can learn all four weather changing moves.)

    Haxorus: Nearly every thing and it's mother can learn this. It's how I got past Wake on a Chimchar/Monferno/Infernape solo run.

    Flygon-Based on Insect-Insects suck and drain things.

    Any Pokemon can have wide movepools, it's mostly based on their design, not type.
    Exactly and for Pokemon, for it to have a type it needs to look or atleast have some characteristics right? So most dragons can breath fire hence all the flamethrowers, most dragons have sharp claws and teeth, Poison Jab/Crunch/ Shadow claw, most have tails (I actually can't think of a dragon not having a tail but I am sure there is some out there) meaning Aqua/Dragon tail. So tell me how you can give it a dragon typing without giving it any characteristics or making it look like the dragon Pokemon.
    Ruby: 0/8
    Sapphire: 0/8
    Emerald: 7/8
    FireRed: 8/8
    LeafGreen: 6/8
    Diamond: 0/8
    Pearl: 0/8
    Platinum: 7/8
    HeartGold: 16/16 (350/493)
    SoulSilver: 9/16
    Black:
    White:
    White 2:
    Black 2:

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  3. #9353
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    All pokemon that are dragon like are hard to accquire......

    Steelix - need to trade plus metal coat
    Aggron - Evolve at high level
    Lapras - Hard to find
    Charizard - available only in trade and as a starter
    Sceptile - Same for Charizard
    Gyarados - Very difficult to train as Magikarp and are not so widely available in later generation.
    Milotic - Have to increase beauty level or trade with prism scale
    Tyranitar - Pseudo-Legendary plus very difficult to catch and find one with desirable nature.
    Aerodactyl - Need Old Amber and the fossil is very hard to get.

  4. #9354
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    I don't think they'll do Dragon starters, not because their OP, but because of type balance between starters. Dragon resists Fire/Water/Grass, so if you had a Fire/Dragon type, the region's water type needs to be part Rock/Ground to have an advantage. Fire/Dragon is an insane offensive typing though, as only Heatran can stop you unless the pokemon learns Earthquake/Fighting move.

    Water/Dragon types are out of the question really, as they are only weak to Dragons, meaning the Grass type has to be a Dragon too and I doubt they'd have 2 starters with the same secondary type. It is also a great offensive type: only Ferrothorn and Empoleon resist both STABs.

    Grass/Dragon is the only plausible one for me. Bar Chespin, all Grass starters are reptiles and the Fire starter would be part Poison, Flying, Bug, lolIce or maybe Steel to compensate. That's a fairly wide range of types and a Grass/Dragon still has 5 weaknesses and Steel types to contend with. Provided that the Dragon typing comes on the final evolution only, this could be balanced.
    Quote Originally Posted by Huspoel View Post
    You're saying some really smart stuff there.

  5. #9355
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    Quote Originally Posted by golduck#1 View Post
    Steel types don't have a great variety of moves though nor do they have many strengths so steel isn't nearly as strong as what dragon would be. Having only the final evo dragon could help a little but not much considering you get most final evo starters around mid game (except Johto) leaving you with ridiculous power for atleast 3 gym towns.





    Yeah you're right about what makes a Pokemon good but all starter Pokemon get atleast 2 good enough stat lines (as in attack, defense etc) and dragon types have ridiculous move pools. Can't every dragon learn flamethrower and water pulse as well as a lot of other different typed moves?

    I could see what your saying on an early Pokemon with the final evo being dragon but starters are good enough to old for themselves without a secondary type, so to add in the dragon type would make it so overpowered compared to anything else.
    i get what you're saying, but it isn't just dragon typing that gives them their status, it's their actual stats
    for example, while garchomp and other dragons are tearing things up in the OU and Ubers, Druddigon is stuck in the NU tier
    why would a dragon be stuck in such low tiers? because of his stats
    dragon isn't an OP type, there are just a lot of pseudo legend dragons
    i mean there are other pokemon with different types in the ubers and OU
    because of scizor and genesect, are you going to say bug is OP?

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  6. #9356
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yveltal96 View Post
    i get what you're saying, but it isn't just dragon typing that gives them their status, it's their actual stats
    for example, while garchomp and other dragons are tearing things up in the OU and Ubers, Druddigon is stuck in the NU tier
    *Cough* RU, and not the rarest thing in UU *Cough*

    Sorry, I'm touchy about my Druddigon. It's my Fifth fave Pokemon, not including evos and prevos!

    But, you do have a point, type doesn't equal stats.

    Back on topic, I'm guessing

    Chespin>Level 18>Level 30
    Fennekin>Level 16>Level 34
    Froakie>Level 14>Level 36

    Just nased on the fact Water is arguably better then Fire in-game, and the same with Fire>Grass.

  7. #9357
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    Quote Originally Posted by MidnightFennekin View Post
    *Cough* RU, and not the rarest thing in UU *Cough*

    Sorry, I'm touchy about my Druddigon. It's my Fifth fave Pokemon, not including evos and prevos!

    But, you do have a point, type doesn't equal stats.

    Back on topic, I'm guessing

    Chespin>Level 18>Level 30
    Fennekin>Level 16>Level 34
    Froakie>Level 14>Level 36

    Just nased on the fact Water is arguably better then Fire in-game, and the same with Fire>Grass.
    well yeah i do love druddigon as well great abuser of stealth rock and dragon tail
    anyways those aren't bad levels to evolve at ^_^
    the levels you put for chespin's evos are turtwig's line's exact evolution levels
    (yes i memorized this i love torterra)

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  8. #9358
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yveltal96 View Post
    i get what you're saying, but it isn't just dragon typing that gives them their status, it's their actual stats
    for example, while garchomp and other dragons are tearing things up in the OU and Ubers, Druddigon is stuck in the NU tier
    why would a dragon be stuck in such low tiers? because of his stats
    dragon isn't an OP type, there are just a lot of pseudo legend dragons
    i mean there are other pokemon with different types in the ubers and OU
    because of scizor and genesect, are you going to say bug is OP?
    FE Dragons in OU and Above: 17
    FE Dragons in OU and Below: 3 (Flygon, Kingdra, Druddigon)

    FE Bugs in OU and Above: 5
    FE Bugs in OU and Below: 28

    Both are inclusive of respective Arceus types.

    Dragons in general have always been op. The only one I can see is Grass/Dragon, and I'm still 100% happy with that idea.

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  9. #9359
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    Quote Originally Posted by OceanicLanturn View Post
    FE Dragons in OU and Above: 17
    FE Dragons in OU and Below: 3 (Flygon, Kingdra, Druddigon)

    FE Bugs in OU and Above: 5
    FE Bugs in OU and Below: 28

    Both are inclusive of respective Arceus types.

    Dragons in general have always been op. The only one I can see is Grass/Dragon, and I'm still 100% happy with that idea.
    Actually, there are 15 FE dragon types in OU and above, and 4 below OU.
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  10. #9360
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Cuddles View Post
    Actually, there are 15 FE dragon types in OU and above, and 4 below OU.
    *flies away*
    I counted Kyurem's and Giratina's formes too. So yeah, 15 FE Dragons. As for below Ou, missed out Altaria XD

    But anyways, my point still stands that Dragon is largely considered as the mythical and rare and strongest type. So slapping it on a starter? No thanks.

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  11. #9361
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    Quote Originally Posted by OceanicLanturn View Post
    I counted Kyurem's and Giratina's formes too. So yeah, 15 FE Dragons. As for below Ou, missed out Altaria XD

    But anyways, my point still stands that Dragon is largely considered as the mythical and rare and strongest type. So slapping it on a starter? No thanks.
    Oh :P But while I think a dragon for a starter could be possible, or just give charizard dragon instead of flying, none of the starters look like they will become dragon type.


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  12. #9362
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    Quote Originally Posted by OceanicLanturn View Post
    FE Dragons in OU and Above: 17
    FE Dragons in OU and Below: 3 (Flygon, Kingdra, Druddigon)

    FE Bugs in OU and Above: 5
    FE Bugs in OU and Below: 28

    Both are inclusive of respective Arceus types.

    Dragons in general have always been op. The only one I can see is Grass/Dragon, and I'm still 100% happy with that idea.
    you completely ignored the other part of my statement
    it's the stats that make the poke not the type
    the reason why there are that many dragons in higher tiers is because most are pseudo legends, legends or have crazy stats anyways
    same goes for the bugs in higher tiers

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  13. #9363
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yveltal96 View Post
    i get what you're saying, but it isn't just dragon typing that gives them their status, it's their actual stats
    for example, while garchomp and other dragons are tearing things up in the OU and Ubers, Druddigon is stuck in the NU tier
    why would a dragon be stuck in such low tiers? because of his stats
    dragon isn't an OP type, there are just a lot of pseudo legend dragons
    i mean there are other pokemon with different types in the ubers and OU
    because of scizor and genesect, are you going to say bug is OP?
    I was going to reply to this but Lanturn did it for me.

    Quote Originally Posted by Yveltal96 View Post
    you completely ignored the other part of my statement
    it's the stats that make the poke not the type
    the reason why there are that many dragons in higher tiers is because most are pseudo legends, legends or have crazy stats anyways
    same goes for the bugs in higher tiers
    Well if the one of the weakest dragon types has a base attack stat of 120, one with a base special defense stat of 105 and one with 95 for all base stats except 85 in speed I think it's safe to say dragons have pretty good stats. Dragons are pretty bulky and resist important types within the games so generally the starter would have to be atleast somewhat bulky in something and no doubt dragons are powerful so it will be good in attack or special attack, leaving it not much room to have anything bad in. What dragon is not a powerful thing? I don't think they will make a dragon type weak just to level it out for other starters.
    Ruby: 0/8
    Sapphire: 0/8
    Emerald: 7/8
    FireRed: 8/8
    LeafGreen: 6/8
    Diamond: 0/8
    Pearl: 0/8
    Platinum: 7/8
    HeartGold: 16/16 (350/493)
    SoulSilver: 9/16
    Black:
    White:
    White 2:
    Black 2:

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  14. #9364
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    Quote Originally Posted by golduck#1 View Post
    I was going to reply to this but Lanturn did it for me.



    Well if the one of the weakest dragon types has a base attack stat of 120, one with a base special defense stat of 105 and one with 95 for all base stats except 85 in speed I think it's safe to say dragons have pretty good stats. Dragons are pretty bulky and resist important types within the games so generally the starter would have to be atleast somewhat bulky in something and no doubt dragons are powerful so it will be good in attack or special attack, leaving it not much room to have anything bad in. What dragon is not a powerful thing? I don't think they will make a dragon type weak just to level it out for other starters.
    What if all starters will make it to OU? They'll possibly get good type coverage, or maybe even a secondary type or ability to make sure the dragon starter doesn't get too overpowered. Remember Empoleon is neutral to grass and fire, yet is not overpowered, because of the secondary types of infernape and torterra.


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  15. #9365
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Cuddles View Post
    What if all starters will make it to OU? They'll possibly get good type coverage, or maybe even a secondary type or ability to make sure the dragon starter doesn't get too overpowered. Remember Empoleon is neutral to grass and fire, yet is not overpowered, because of the secondary types of infernape and torterra.
    Because steel is probably the worst offensive typing in the game. It didn't really gain much ground, if anything it lost ground being weak to Infernapes fighting type.
    Ruby: 0/8
    Sapphire: 0/8
    Emerald: 7/8
    FireRed: 8/8
    LeafGreen: 6/8
    Diamond: 0/8
    Pearl: 0/8
    Platinum: 7/8
    HeartGold: 16/16 (350/493)
    SoulSilver: 9/16
    Black:
    White:
    White 2:
    Black 2:

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  16. #9366
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    Quote Originally Posted by golduck#1 View Post
    Because steel is probably the worst offensive typing in the game. It didn't really gain much ground, if anything it lost ground being weak to Infernapes fighting type.
    Poison is actually the worst.

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  17. #9367
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    Quote Originally Posted by golduck#1 View Post
    Because steel is probably the worst offensive typing in the game. It didn't really gain much ground, if anything it lost ground being weak to Infernapes fighting type.
    Steel is super-effective against ice and rock. Steel resists steel, grass, flying, dragon, ice, psychic, dark, and ghost. Steel is immune to poison.
    Poison is super-effective against grass only. Poison resists poison, grass, bug, and fighting.
    Normal is not super-effective against any other types. It is immune to ghost.

    Steel is as offensive as ghost.
    Poison and Normal are the worst offensive typings in the game.

  18. #9368
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    Quote Originally Posted by rocky505 View Post
    Poison is actually the worst.
    But it's great when coupled with other types...Like Fire/Poison.Might sound terrible offensively,but it resists 7 types.

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    Quote Originally Posted by golduck#1 View Post
    Because steel is probably the worst offensive typing in the game. It didn't really gain much ground, if anything it lost ground being weak to Infernapes fighting type.
    Not everything is about offense.. It gained 7 resistances and one immunity.


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  20. #9370
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    Quote Originally Posted by confuser987 View Post
    Poison and Normal are the worst offensive typings in the game.
    Normal is one of the best offenses in the game. It's not super-effective on anything, but it's only resisted by Rock and Steel.
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  21. #9371
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    Fennekin evolves into fire/ground.
    Chespin evolves into grass/poison.
    Froakie evolves into water/grass ( first starter evolution to get another starter typing as a secondary typing). It can have a lilypad like Ludicolo line.

    So Froakie's evolutions is weak against Chespin Evol's poison. Chesping is weak against Fennekin Evol's regular fire. Fennekin's evol is weak against Froakie's regular water.
    Chespin' evol can do supereffective poison damage to Froakie's evolution. And Fennekin can do its STAB neutral damage and non-STAB psychic damage against Froakie's evol. Chespin's evol can do neutral grass damage on Fennekin's evol
    Last edited by confuser987; 17th March 2013 at 4:57 PM.

  22. #9372
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    Strange as it seems, ground is probably the best offensive typing in the game. It also helps that many ground type pokemon can learn normal type attacks.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pookey-man View Post
    Strange as it seems, ground is probably the best offensive typing in the game. It also helps that many ground type pokemon can learn normal type attacks.
    And Fighting.

    I hope Chespin is part Dark. Grass/Dark is a very good type combination, even though it has many weaknesses. Shiftry and Cacturne were very good.
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  24. #9374
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    How about
    Fire/Normal
    Grass/Normal
    Water/Normal.

  25. #9375
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    Quote Originally Posted by confuser987 View Post
    How about
    Fire/Normal
    Grass/Normal
    Water/Normal.
    How about not.
    Starters should never be Normal, because there not! Pun intended.
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