How about what I feel is probably the most forgotten pokemon there is? Masquerain.
How about what I feel is probably the most forgotten pokemon there is? Masquerain.
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Even so, Masquerin's stat doesn't make it for it. Nor is it nostalgic, or unique like Surskit (water/bug type). Tbh I prefer Butterfree.
Worst 6? Magikarp. Azurill. Pichu. Cleffa. Basically all baby pokemon except Wyanut, Magby and Elekid.
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Last edited by RealRaymon; 11th January 2013 at 1:17 PM.
BidoofLedian. Practically useless unless you're using it to catch other pokemon in-game, seeing as how it has incredibly high Sp. Def. and an average Def. stat.
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I'd like to ask if there is a particular version anyone found substantially harder than others, seeing as i want this to be as hard as possible.
@ Excitable Boy: true, but its possible to reset if you acidently the wrong move. (not that i would do that, not me, no sir) but the concept of sketch, to me, is very daunting, I mean, ANY move, just seems a bit much. This is honestly the hardest decision i've had to make on this so far. And the sp.def on ledian is definitely the biggest reason i was considering taking it off the list in the first place, plus with the 2nd best speed of the 8 i'm still considering and reflect access, it's looking to be one of the best ones. I'm almost 100% sure its getting the boot, just gonna mul it over a bit
@ pikadon92: the ones you listed have all around better stats than the ones I'm still considering for my run, and while stats aren't everything, none of my considerations have any good abilities aside from status immunities, so i don't think these would make it more challenging. And while i've never actually used ditto at all, i would imagine that imposter ditto in-game isn't too great, like you said, but I think there are worse.
@ VampirateMace: you're probably right, and i've decided not to use castform, delcatty, volbeat and illumise. I'll edit my 1st post to reflect this. however, as much as shedinja loves to get KO'd, he'll be able to make mincemeat out of a good handful of trainers, and probably some gym leaders too.
@ Cutty: I've actually used lumineon, and while it wasn't good by any means, i've used worse, plus it has ok abilities and better all-around stats compared to the ones i'm still considering, which are ones you mentioned otherwise
@ GildedScizor: I'll agree masquerain is probably one of the most forgotten pokemon out there, but, again its stats out-class my remaining pokemon, plus intimidate will be a godsend for this run, so i'll have to pass on it
OceanicLanturn: agreed on masquerain, not that great, in general, even w/ the water/ice moves. And i'm looking for fully evolved pokemon, so they won't work.
@ RaZoR LeAf: you think fearow is on par w/ farfetch'd? That's surprising, I've used both, and fearow, from what i could tell, was doing his fair share of the work, and farfetch'd, while not as bad as i thought, was worse than him by a good margin. Could just be my personal experience i suppose. But honestly, I don't think any team on 1st gen games would be actually hard, i just find them to be so easy. It could be the terrible AI or it could be that i've played them countless times, but i would be surprised if there was a way to make them actually difficult to play
@ Specter Vyle: and just when i was thinking to take it off the list, someone mentions it again. I'm still probably taking it off, as it seems more useful to me than the others, but if there is a good argument for it i would gladly reconsider
Ledian getting the boot if no one has a good argument for it to stay, as it gets reflect and light screen, and already has huge sp.def, and sp.atk is on par w/ the rest for the most part
and smeargle info, anyone used it in-game? cuz 1st hand exp on this issue would probably be the best, actually if anyone has used anything in my 1st post in-game that would be helpful
Again, great info guys, keep it coming!
Last edited by wauknay84; 12th January 2013 at 2:20 AM.
Hmm... well, if I was making this team, the final lineup of fully evolved Pokemon would probably be:
Ledian, Sunflora (with Chlorophyll. It actually has use with Solar Power.), Unown, Luvdisc, Beedrill, and Wobbuffet.
The first five are pretty self explanatory, crappy stats with limited movepools and very limited usefulness. I don't really think Farfetch'd or even Delibird are quite as bad as any of those. Farfetch'd does actually learn some pretty nice moves by level-up alone, and Delibird has Ice typing which means that, in spite of its craptacular stats it can fire off STAB Ice Beam which is surprisingly useful. Wobbuffet is there because the thing is an absolute headache to use in-game. It does... NOTHING. In competitive play, you can at least expect your opponent to make sane decisions about what moves they put on their Pokemon and what their strategy will be. In-game, it's anyone's guess. You can only hope to use Mirror Coat when the opponent is using a special attack/Counter for physical, or use Destiny bond at the right time or whatever. It's maddeningly useless in-game.
Yes, Ditto does deserve a place as one of the worst Pokemon to use, but it's just so...hideous. Personally, I wouldn't like to see that thing in battle after battle. Too depressing.
I'm a little surprised that Spinda has gained a place on your team though. In terms of stats, it does completely suck, but it does actually gain some pretty sweet moves via level-up, not to mention all the TM moves it has access to. I think Sunflora, for example, beats it out as a worse Pokemon, even though it has a fairly high Sp.Atk, because of its limited movepool, its horrendous speed, and its really sucky defenses coupled with Grass typing.
I will mention that I have personally used Ledian in-game, though not for long. It's one of those "headache" Pokemon, it just doesn't do much and it gets KOd really quickly. The only points in its favour are that it can a) baton-pass if you're lucky enough to survive a turn of setup and b) learns Comet Punch, which is a move that is crappy, but also rare and kind of cool. It's definitely a crummy Pokemon. Maybe not the worst one out there (That's Unown's title.), but it is pretty bad.
Last edited by zozo; 12th January 2013 at 3:18 AM.
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@ AK Adam: when i started this thread i was considering plusle, minun, and pachirisu, but have since booted them. Mainly because their offences (plusle and minun anyway)are far superior to any of the one i have left. And i used minun at one point for a small amount of time, actually forgot about it, but remembering back, he wasn't too bad. As for pikachu, once he evolves, his offences and speed are way better than anything i'm still considering, so no need to worry about any of them being bottom 6 if you ask me
@ zozo: lt of things to say so i broke it up a bit
- Sunflora and Beedrill just have too good of stats in places if you ask me. I've used both to some extent, and they didn't fair too poorly. Compared to others i'm still considering, in general, their stats are too good and their movepool is about on par as far as i can tell. Actually, i find sunflora to be a really easy pokemon to use just based off its movepool. 105 sp.atk? not needed so much, train its defences, teach it ingrain, toxic and leech seed, and have backups for any poison or grass types and your good to go!
- For farfetch'd, the only moves that seem better than average are brave bird and obviously swords dance, which i suppose could be a major factor. granted he gets good moves like night slash and similar things, but almost all pokemon are going to have some good moves in their pool, its not something you can prevent, only ditto and unown are really going to be having an actually "bad" movepool. although, looking at just the average stats offensively and defensively, farfetch'd is one of the better ones i'm still considering.
- if Delibird's ice beam is the only thing to consider taking it off, i definitely see where your coming from, but that's only one attack. it will be helpful. yes, but is it the most helpful thing possible left on the team? it might be, considering. i'll definitely take this into consideration, but his typing is also ice/flying, which as we all know is far from good. So far typing hasn't really been a concern for me, i find it interesting that it may be delibird's deciding factor
- I think i've mentioned it before, but i have used wobbofet, at least to a point, and he could easily take out at least 1 pokemon on the opposing team each time. And since the AI of the games are so easily predictable, and since his bulk far surpasses a lot of pokemon, i don't think he would be as bad as the others
- About ditto, I've only used him in a few battles on silver, when he was a good 10 lvls higher than the opponent, but i feel like when i'm done with this play-thru, i'll have a burning hate for the little blob haha
- As far as spinda, yes it has some pretty good moves, but again, most pokemon are going to have some moves that are decent, if not really good. but if they lack the stats to pull them off, there isn't a lot they can do with them, and looking at spinda's moves, he won't be able to make very good use out of them. And my own explanation for using spinda has made me decide smearle is indeed in the runnings, if not guaranteed. funny how that works i suppose.
- And finally ledian: i feel really dumb. i completely forgot it had baton pass. plus it can get swords dance. I think your hurting its cause more than helping! haha. I definitely agree that its bad, but maybe w/ baton pass, screens, and that sweet sp.def stat, it will probably have to go
But I think it's more or less a mutual agreement that Ditto, Unown, and Luvdisc are for sure in the bottom, so it looks like i'll be using them for sure, and thanks to a recent epiphany, smeargle as well, so looks like i might have most of my team, thanks again, all this idea bouncing has helped more than i thought it would
Last edited by wauknay84; 12th January 2013 at 4:18 PM.
6 worst pokemon? a team full of Dunsparce. Seriously, I tried doing that and lost to a machoke. A Machoke. He wanted all of the D
(as in Dunsparce, Perverts).
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Well, I had one heck of a bad time trying to go through Heart Gold with both Parasect and Victreebel. Parasect is the worst of those two, but Victreebel still didn't help with its best abilities being Cut and Acid until I trashed both of them. Victreebel could possibly be good if used right, haven't checked up on that, but I refuse to believe that there's any use in Parasect unless I'm shown it be useful for anything else than a Powder machine, and there are many better ones of that kind than 4x weak against fire Parasect.
Farfetch'd is fantastic.
Lumineon is terrible. Think about it, IN GAME. It's stats aren't fantastic, but it's definitely not the worst. It's movepool isn't fantastic, again it's definitely not the worst. What makes it truly terrible is how you get it late game as it's pre-evolved form and any sane person wouldn't catch it unless they liked it's design or whatever. (I like it's design by the way. But, we're talking about IN GAME.) Trying to train it to evolve it and then use it then becomes even more of a hassle because the next gym is... Electric! So, there is no real point in using it IN GAME.
This applies to several other Pokemon, depending on the game. Marill in G/S. Glameow in D/P. Ditto in any game. Unown in any game. Delibird in any game.
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I used a Spinda in Emerald, it wasn't amazing obviously, but it proved surprisingly useful with things like Teeter Dance, plus its own ability prevents confusion on itself. It's a good annoyer, I personally wouldn't rank it as one of the six worst. But it's a tough call between the ones you have remaining.
If we're going by fully evolved or non-evolving Pokemon only, I'd say Smeargle, Ditto, Spinda, Far'fetchd, Luvdisc, and Unown.
This also assumes no access to DW abilities to make the first three semi-usable, nor access to other party Pokemon Smeargle can sketch a decent moveset from.
@ AK Adam: now THERE's an interesting idea. never thought of using larvesta from the beginning, it would indeed be a huge hassle for him not evolving until way late. Only thing tho, i am keeping any non-fully evolved pokemon off the list, plus he's got surprisingly good atk. thanks for the suggestion tho, that's a good point, but i want fully evolved w/o exceptions.
@ Autis-misc: never thought of doing a 6 of the same pokemon run before... sounds interesting. but honestly, i want 6 different ones. My goal is to eventually use every pokemon evolutionary line, in some way shape or form and this play-thru is helping me w/ some of the ones i wouldn't use normally.
@ Masterofknees: whoah, did you just dis victreebell? used him on my 1st ever play-thru, on silver, definitely NOT one of the worst. granted, not great, but i won't stand for someone knocking my original team! And for parasect, i used him recently on blue (maybe it was yellow), he was actually really good, think i had mega drain, spore, slash, and dig. granted it was blue, so anything is usable, but i had a lot of fun w/ him. I fail to see why people think he's one of the worst, especially w/ spore. 4x weakness =/= bad, i mean look at all those dragons. granted they have good stats and parasect doesn't, but i thnk he's pretty decent and make up ok for his bad stats
@ master of murkrow: audino and electrode i could see as bad, zebstrika i could see as average, but tauros? seriously, what? he's fallen since RBY but c'mon.
@ Jonny2013: lol saying farfetch'd is fantastic w/ no follow-up statement isn't very convincing, haha, but i did like using him on blue. I've used lumineon before, granted i used him from the start, but he was niether good nor bad, really averge and boring to use, but then i don't like him much at all, but ya, catching him and trying to use him where you find him in-game would be a hassle, but the gym you go to after you get him is steel, then ice, and electric is last (assuming DPP)
@ The Benmeister: see that's the thing, i'm not sure where exactly to go with what i've got left, there're arguments for/against some, but none seem that much more convincing than the last. i think most of what i have will be tough to use, but some, like spinda, would do ok w/ a good team to back them up, at least i think so anyway. I've never used any of them before, other than farfetch'd, so i'm not sure which ones wold be better, but that's why i wanna use 'em. I still appreciate the 1st hand exp. tho, i think it'll help
@ Rakurai: right, no way am i using dream world abilities, pretty much 100% certain i'm using platinum. and i'm pretty sure smeargle (i'm not sure what moves could really redeem his offences) ditto, unown, and luvdisc are guaranteed at this point too, just looking to get them last two spots filled. just wondering, why not delibird or ledian do you think?
@ John Wallrein: haha, can't say i've ever had QUITE that experience before, but i think farfetch'd might possibly be one o the better ones i'm still considering, i'm just not sure
Well, i've got m platinum ready to go, got everything hatched and ready to go, just need to tell two of the following to take a hike:
Farfetch'd, Delibird, Spinda, Ledian. I know they have their strong points, but are there really any worse? I have yet to be convinced. Anyway, would love to hear arguments for/against these 4 if you've got any
I had a shiny bellsprout from route (whatever is north of misty's gym) OKay till Surge then, no good moves until level 40-ish! Evolve stuck with horrible moves, don't exceedingly weak. Don't get me wrong, I think victreeble is awesome with good moves but in leafgreen it is torture to train, and I gave up on a bleepin SHINY from not having a attack over 60 Base Power! I totally get it, I hate people who rag on Venasaur, my first ever pokemon... (course I HAD to level him up with the 999 rare candy cheat from AR, neve ruse the thing after losing the ability to go to the battle area in pearl, a year after), I will admit Venasuar hasn't stood the test of time well.
Also, all out offensive ninjask with choice band and swords dance. Or just ninjask attack only.
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