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Thread: A Unova League Evolution (769)

  1. #76
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    This episode sounds like a waste of time to watch imo. The fact that Ash is placing lower than last time in Sinnoh makes it worse. Hopefully the N series is way better than what we've gotten so far from BW.
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  2. #77
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    Quote Originally Posted by Joltik-Kid View Post
    I find it odd that despite this being the UNOVA league, someone who doesn't even use a single Unova Pokemon wins the thing and it didn't even look like he cared afterwards that he won it. Why does a rescuer need a League trophy anyway?
    I find this hella hilarious.

    Anyway let's just move on with our lives. Ash lost like we expected but at least Cameron didn't win the whole thing. Eevee beating a Druddigon was kind of a funny though.

  3. #78
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    Quote Originally Posted by Haunter227 View Post
    It's not Ash losing that depresses me, it's the fact that he resembles nothing of his former self aside from his plot devices. And i'm not talking about his art design either (although it does make things worse) since his AG and DP changed but still resembled him. I'm talking about how he doesn't act anything like how did in OS, AG or DP anymore. I really can't explain how but I'm sure people know what I mean and it's enfuriating to think the writers would change him so much throughout his lifespan.
    That's sorta what I meant, as it ties in with what your saying. OS Ash even won stuff before losing in the league and that was before he got smarter in AG/DP. Even more, he never had to heavily rely on evolution's in Gym battles to win the day for him. Ash only seemed to ever do his out of the box thinking with Oshawott (besides Pikachu) and that was only twice (both involved Water Gun). It like this was a completely different person we saw battling, yet we know for a fact that he's the same Ash since we saw the Sinnoh stuff in episode 1 of BW. It's just frustrating to see this go down after witnessing awesomeness of Ash beating two Legendary Pokemon in the Sinnoh league. Pikachu can tie with a Latios, but loses to a tired Lucario
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  4. #79

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    Quote Originally Posted by CyberCubed View Post
    This league was a nightmare. I just cannot understand what happened.
    There have been a tonne of moments and episodes i've loved in BW, but it's not the League that was a nightmare, it's the entire saga. The League simply got given the BW treatement like everything else, being terrible.

  5. #80
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    Truly a terrible league.
    1. The writers built Shooti up to be a TOUGH rival, who Ash always lost to, only to have him pummeled and disqualified in the eyes of fans in the JUNIOR Cup, by losing to Adler. Ash lost to Elite 4 members before, and Paul lost to Cynthia, but neither were emasculated. Did we have a decent, final battle between Ash and Shooti, like the 6 on 6 battles with Gary and Paul? Nope. Instead we had a 1 on 1 preliminary battle, in which Shooti's strongest, which blazed through the Junior Cup, was brought down- granted this was done by Pikachu, but still. NOT climactic.

    2. WHY were their preliminaries when there was an even 128? >.< Not to mention, there were ONLY 128 trainers!

    3. The league was only SIX episodes, shortest yet.

    4. With that said, and Gen VI not being till next October, WHY was there a filler episode (Kibago) with TWO RUSHED battles!?

    5. ALL of Ash's important battles were with rivals we saw him battle throughout the region already. -_-;; No interesting original League trainers, AKA Tyson with Meowth in Boots, Jenette with her kung-fu Bellsprout, or Tobias with Darkrai.

    6. Unova is supposed to be based on America, right? Which is like.... LARGE in land and population, right? So why did we recognize so many character of the days in the crowd of trainers?

    7. Kotetsu is scatter-brained and clumsy, to have Ash lose to him when comparied to Richie, Harrison, Tobias, or Tyson is sad.

    8. Ash defeated a Lucario before when he battled Maylene, and it was NOT newly evolved. This is crap compared to losing to Darkrai/Latios, Meowth-in-boots, Blaziken (bear in mind Harrison probly had that Blaziken all that time as his starter)

    9. Ash lost even though Kotetsu was down by one Pokemon to begin with -_-

    10. Top 8? The poor kid regressed? Oh well, at least he is taking this loss easiest of all of his past ones

    11. Ash seriously needs to return to his "normal", experienced self that developed between Gens. I-IV when Unova is over -_-

    12. No Charles Goodshow? He couldn't take a plane like Ash, Oak, Deliah did?

    13; Did they even bother to talk about if this flame was a Moltres or Ho-oh flame?

    14. The fact that the stupid rocker character of the day got anywhere close to first place is just wrong.

    15. Virigil, unlike everyone else who defeated Ash, seems to be a part-time Trainer due to the rescue squad he and his brother won. A part-time trainer won a regional league? Really? -_-

    The battles in themselves that were ACTUALLY allowed to be full-length were decent though, and I liked the flashbacks.

  6. #81
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    Quote Originally Posted by Haunter227 View Post
    It's not Ash losing that depresses me, it's the fact that he resembles nothing of his former self aside from his plot devices. And i'm not talking about his art design either (although it does make things worse) since his AG and DP changed but still resembled him. I'm talking about how he doesn't act anything like how did in OS, AG or DP anymore. I really can't explain how but I'm sure people know what I mean and it's enfuriating to think the writers would change him so much throughout his lifespan.
    It always bugged me that for some odd reason Gary sort of "matured" or kind of grew as a trainer and character, while Ash kind of keeps going down hill. I know Gary was just used for set reason, but they did start at the same time. It just seems like lazy writing.

    I guess they just like cleaning Ash's slate now.

  7. #82
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    Quote Originally Posted by DawnBoy View Post
    This episode sounds like a waste of time to watch imo. The fact that Ash is placing lower than last time in Sinnoh makes it worse. Hopefully the N series is way better than what we've gotten so far from BW.
    I disagree. You can't honestly expect Ash to move up in rank in every league. Sometimes this just comes out to luck, just like when you play the tournament in your game, sometimes you win, other times you don't get past the first round. I think people put too much pressure and expectation on Ash.

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    Quote Originally Posted by gohan5 View Post
    I disagree. You can't honestly expect Ash to move up in rank in every league. Sometimes this just comes out to luck, just like when you play the tournament in your game, sometimes you win, other times you don't get past the first round. I think people put too much pressure and expectation on Ash.
    Too much pressure is a understatement, more like too much faith.

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    Quote Originally Posted by RickHoenn View Post
    He used reserves back in DP and that's how he got to top 4, he used reserves back in Johto and that's why he got top 8 for the first time.
    I'm pretty sure the writers would have had Infernape go blaze mode killing everything, even if Snorlax/Heracross/Quilava/Noctowl/Donphan/whatever else wasn't there. And if not that, Pikachu.

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  10. #85
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    His entire style of battling regressed though, its like he gained no experience from anything he does. We saw progress from Hoenn to Sinnoh, so why did it all just go in a flash like nothing ever happened?

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    It makes me almost think that the writers hate Ash and they are tired of using him..

  12. #87
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    Quote Originally Posted by Malcolm Belmont View Post
    It makes me almost think that the writers hate Ash and they are tired of using him..
    No it doesn't. Just becuase he doesn;t advance higher doe not mean they hate him. In real life, you get a lower grade than your last, that's how life is. It has nothing to do with them hating Ash. They don't hate any of their characters.

  13. #88
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hero of Ideals View Post
    No it doesn't. Just becuase he doesn;t advance higher doe not mean they hate him. In real life, you get a lower grade than your last, that's how life is. It has nothing to do with them hating Ash. They don't hate any of their characters.
    Burgundy, Stunfisk and Palpitoad seem to say otherwise

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  14. #89

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    Quote Originally Posted by Joltik-Kid View Post
    That's sorta what I meant, as it ties in with what your saying. OS Ash even won stuff before losing in the league and that was before he got smarter in AG/DP. Even more, he never had to heavily rely on evolution's in Gym battles to win the day for him. Ash only seemed to ever do his out of the box thinking with Oshawott (besides Pikachu) and that was only twice (both involved Water Gun). It like this was a completely different person we saw battling, yet we know for a fact that he's the same Ash since we saw the Sinnoh stuff in episode 1 of BW. It's just frustrating to see this go down after witnessing awesomeness of Ash beating two Legendary Pokemon in the Sinnoh league. Pikachu can tie with a Latios, but loses to a tired Lucario
    Exactly, personally for me a lot of it isn't because of battles for me. That's not what bothers me since that isn't specifically a change in his character. The change in his character what i dislike can be noticed so heavily if you watch one episode from the OS and one from BW.

    Quote Originally Posted by Takaru View Post
    It always bugged me that for some odd reason Gary sort of "matured" or kind of grew as a trainer and character, while Ash kind of keeps going down hill. I know Gary was just used for set reason, but they did start at the same time. It just seems like lazy writing.

    I guess they just like cleaning Ash's slate now.
    It'll be interesting to see if when Gary returns if he's incredibly mature and looks older, or whether he has been turned into a little kid again like Ash did.

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    Quote Originally Posted by TheSirPeras View Post
    Burgundy, Stunfisk and Palpitoad seem to say otherwise

    I do the same thing, It doesn;t mean I hate a character. I just have a humor bone in my body.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hero of Ideals View Post
    I do the same thing, It doesn;t mean I hate a character. I just have a humor bone in my body.
    Being absent is not funny, it just shows they were only thrown in there for the plot of Oshawott's Aqua Jet. Thoug Burgundy, if she had gotten 1 win, it would be alright

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  17. #92
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheSirPeras View Post
    Being absent is not funny, it just shows they were only thrown in there for the plot of Oshawott's Aqua Jet. Thoug Burgundy, if she had gotten 1 win, it would be alright
    I was talking about Cilan's rival, not the Pokemon. People expected too much out of Best Wishes, now they are calling it the worst saga. And How so we know they hate Palpatoad or Stunfisk, are we from Japan, are we the writers? No, we are not.

  18. #93
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    You know I find sad, that this could have easily been the greatest league ever, but instead it got rushed and left little value. Did the animation staff petition to get as little work as possible, because not having a single full battle shown onscreen is just fall out wrong. If they seriously hate animating things that are "too difficult" then they should have never entered the career they've chosen.

    Quote Originally Posted by Haunter227 View Post
    Exactly, personally for me a lot of it isn't because of battles for me. That's not what bothers me since that isn't specifically a change in his character. The change in his character what i dislike can be noticed so heavily if you watch one episode from the OS and one from BW.
    Like I said it all ties in as his personality relies on battles, as the character himself lives to battle. So yeah, I've noticed the certain "spark" as you could call it, shift in Best Wishes. He doesn't seem like he seriously wants to do anything
    Last edited by Joltik-Kid; 10th January 2013 at 6:51 PM.
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  19. #94
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hero of Ideals View Post
    I thought it meant Cilan's rival, not the Pokemon. People expected too much out of Best Wishes, now they are calling it the worst saga.
    All of them were terribly handled tbh People expected good things because of Sinnoh, or course we would like to see battles and wise Ash and be upset when Ash does terrible in the league comparing to Snnoh. If this had been a saga after Johto or Hoenn it wouldn't have been very bad, but Sinnoh made our expectations higher

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  20. #95

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    Darn...i REALLY wanted Dino to win the League. After all the foreshadowing and the fact Virgil won against Kotetsu, it would have been great for him to lose against Dino. But no...

    Oh well, atleast he took the second place, that's always something. Ash will never get that :P

    And the ending, nice..but it would fit more for..Episode N ending than this? It's not like adventures in Unova are over or something.

  21. #96
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheSirPeras View Post
    All of them were terribly handled tbh People expected good things because of Sinnoh, or course we would like to see battles and wise Ash and be upset when Ash does terrible in the league comparing to Snnoh. If this had been a saga after Johto or Hoenn it wouldn't have been very bad, but Sinnoh made our expectations higher

    Just because Sinnoh was to everyone the best saga ever, doesn't mean to hype Best Wishes to live up to your expectaions. That's how life goes, you can't always get what you want. And no, they were not terribly handled just becuse they never battled much.

  22. #97
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    Seeing Cameron beat Ash was a disappointment but seeing Virgil also only use 5 vs Cameron was great. Nice "payback." I expected Virgil to win ever since he was introduced and was surprised at Dino and Ramone's lineup. It's sad when the rival battles were more interesting than Ash's battles (exception being vs Stephan). Virgil was pretty cool and I hope he returns occasionally. Loved seeing Espeon, Flareon and Eevee. Trump Card was cool.

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  23. #98
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    Quote Originally Posted by Joltik-Kid View Post
    You know I find sad, that this could have easily been the greatest league ever, but instead it got rushed and left little value. Did the animation staff petition to get as little work as possible, because not having a single full battle shown onscreen is just fall out wrong. If they seriously hate animating things that are "too difficult" then they should have never entered the career they've chosen.
    I don't think that the anime staff is "lazy" necessarily, but rather that we're feeling the effects of a 3 year series now. A DP pace was never possible for this series and it probably could have seen the benefits from a little less rushing. But the games keep coming now, faster than ever before, and the anime is showing that.

    (credit goes to Skiyomi)

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hero of Ideals View Post
    Just because Sinnoh was to everyone the best saga ever, doesn't mean to hype Best Wishes to live up to your expectaions. That's how life goes, you can't always get what you want. And no, they were not terribly handled just becuse they never battled much.
    You're right, they were also terribly handled because Palpitoad was a war machine, and Stunfisk was exactly the opposite of that. Plus you know, the lack of decent appearances... 30 episodes without appearing really hits you.
    And yes, if we just come from a season where Pikachu ties with a Latias, Ash was his smartest self, Paul was a great rival, and the battles (league battles too) were well made and not rushed, your expectations will be higher.

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  25. #100

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    Quote Originally Posted by gohan5 View Post
    I don't think that the anime staff is "lazy" necessarily, but rather that we're feeling the effects of a 3 year series now. A DP pace was never possible for this series and it probably could have seen the benefits from a little less rushing. But the games keep coming now, faster than ever before, and the anime is showing that.
    That's why Sinnoh/Gen IV will always be my favorite Anime and Game saga of Pokemon respectively. I loved the atmosphere, the pacing was great, battles were exciting and even Fillers were fun. Darn Best Wishes for ruining Sinnoh's league and Darn 6th Gen for ruining Best Wishes's league. Will this become a loop now?

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