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Thread: Why the mixed reception in the PMD series?

  1. #1

    Default Why the mixed reception in the PMD series?

    Like, when Red and Blue rescue team came out, they were blasted with mixed scores, even though they were very fun and good games.

    And Explorers of Sky has gotten the worst case of it, with more reviews being bad due to the similarity to EOT/EOD.

    But that purposes a question...

    Why? Why do the PMD games always get such low scores for no reason at all? It confuses me, considering how other similar games are rated much higher...

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    People tend to have a love or hate relationship with roguelikes in general, and PMD has likely been the first exposure many have had to that style of gameplay.

  3. #3

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    Hmm... But Ys on the Turbographix 16 back in the day got near perfect reviews, and it plays exactly the same.... So why is PMD not given the same love?

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    Ys is an action RPG, which is a different thing entirely.

    The defining traits of a typical roguelike are randomized dungeons, turn based combat, and harsh death penalties.
    Last edited by Rakurai; 10th January 2013 at 11:42 PM.

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    With all the rabid PMD fans that are around, it's hardly accurate to say the series is being victimised. Not everybody around shares the same opinions on the series, I'm sure, and I bet that whatever mixed or negative reviews the games got will explain why they didn't like it.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Griff4815 View Post
    With all the rabid PMD fans that are around, it's hardly accurate to say the series is being victimised. Not everybody around shares the same opinions on the series, I'm sure, and I bet that whatever mixed or negative reviews the games got will explain why they didn't like it.
    I know. But some of the reviews don't even make sense. Some reviews didn't even mention the fact that you can use moves! (They thought the bash was it)

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    Stupid reviewers have, and always shall exist.

    Some of them don't even give the games they review more then a hour or two before they draw conclusions about it.

  8. #8

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rakurai View Post
    Stupid reviewers have, and always shall exist.

    Some of them don't even give the games they review more then a hour or two before they draw conclusions about it.
    I guess you are right. But still, considering how Red rescue team is my favorite game (In HISTORY), It saddens me to see it bashed for the stupidest reasons...

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    The all I can say is that PMD has mixed reviews for two solid reasons.

    The first is that people may not like rougelikes in general which I imagine is not uncommon because, from my experience, that it is an uncommon genre (I didn't even know that PMD was a rouge-like until I discovered that it was here). Sad, but people WILL review these sorts of games disregarding the genre because they may be unfamiliar with said genre.

    The second reason is that PMD has a lot of balance issues, with PMD1 arguably being the more balanced of the two. Spite and Grudge, in particular, are very unforgiving moves because they drain the PP of the last attack you used to zero. Perish Song is worse, affecting every pokemon on the floor with an incurable condition that causes them to faint in three turns, but there is only like a 10% chance of it working on any given pokemon and so is arguably more forgiving than Spite/Grudge. In PMD2, you encounter OP Starly on Mount Bristle, in Sky you find Buneary that do 45 damage with Frustration in Foggy Forest, Sand Veil/Snow Cloak can easily wear you down in a game of luck, Focus Punch can actually OHKO some of the bosses (given the right conditions, which can be easy if you end up as a Riolu, which I did in Sky) when you are like Level 55 - 60 in the postgame dungeons and the Drifloon/Dribifloon in Chasm Cave can easily sweep you with Unburden Ominous Wind.
    Those are just some of the more bigger balancing issues I have with the games. P.S.: Don't get me started on the PP-Zero and Pitfall traps...

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    PMD is extremely tame by typical roguelike standards; the ability to get rescued being one of the biggest conveniences.

    The genre basically delights in having various ways to give you a quick, unexpected demise. Pretty much all of the things you mentioned can be dealt with in one way or another, though (My preferred method being to simply not allow any Pokemon to get close enough to use threatening moves by loading up on ranged attacks). Even Perish Song can be removed by using a Heal Seed or Healing Wish (Which can be linked to a recovery move on most of its users to offset the HP loss).

  11. #11

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    Luckily it seems Famitsu gave PMD 3DS two perfect scores, so I think it is getting more well known

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rakurai View Post
    People tend to have a love or hate relationship with roguelikes in general, and PMD has likely been the first exposure many have had to that style of gameplay.
    It's pretty much this. Especially if you go around and look at some game sites' reviews for when Red and Blue rescue team came out, you can tell the reviewer is having a first-time experience with a rogue like. There's plenty of scenarios in which they comment on traits such as randomized dungeons or spawning on stairs when those more exposed to the genre wouldn't think twice about them.

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    It was the first rougelike game I've played. And I rather like the PMD games. They hold SO many memories.

    Remember, critics can have bad opinions at times, and there are some out there that are the snobby assholes whole hate life and say that everything people like sucks. I've had to cope with liking games that get bad reviews, Medal of Honor: Warfighter to be more specific. It got a 5/10 on GI and a 2/10 on IGN, but it was a great game! Trust me, IGN only likes the big games that'll give them money to advertise is out of the picture, so their reviews are pretty much pointless to read. Game Informer on the other hand is more reliable, and funny when they insult games. I may not agree with whoever reviewed MoH: WF, but you just have to shrug aside reviews you disagree with. Get pissed if you want, but it's not like you'll be able to change their opinion.
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    Maybe it's because it's a bit different? Which is odd, as a lot of Pokémon fans have always liked the idea of knowing what the Pokémon say, and to also know what they do. So personally, I think the Mystery Dungeon series has always been a wonderful idea. I like the idea of a questionnaire determining what Pokémon you'll be (usually different with each play-through), so there's no exact popular Pokémon people choose to be. The story is also really good (Explorers, anyway), and dark to boot. Seriously, outside of B/W, and possibly Platinum, when has the Pokémon series been this dark? I love that.

    So I don't know exactly why these games have mixed reviews, but who cares? They still sell well, and are fondly remembered by those who do like the games. It's the same with all of the other games. Whether these reviewers/critics get paid or not, it's all based on biased opinion. So if you like the games, that's fine. If someone doesn't like the games, that's fine, too (as long as they give reasons why they don't like the games). Opinions will be opinions.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Meeker View Post
    It was the first rougelike game I've played. And I rather like the PMD games. They hold SO many memories.

    Remember, critics can have bad opinions at times, and there are some out there that are the snobby assholes whole hate life and say that everything people like sucks. I've had to cope with liking games that get bad reviews, Medal of Honor: Warfighter to be more specific. It got a 5/10 on GI and a 2/10 on IGN, but it was a great game! Trust me, IGN only likes the big games that'll give them money to advertise is out of the picture, so their reviews are pretty much pointless to read. Game Informer on the other hand is more reliable, and funny when they insult games. I may not agree with whoever reviewed MoH: WF, but you just have to shrug aside reviews you disagree with. Get pissed if you want, but it's not like you'll be able to change their opinion.
    IGN is absolutely terrible. Every year the Call of Duty games get perfect reviews. They also leave out the negatives (like the story) but as soon as those negatives improve slightly, they say it's the best thing ever (take the Black Ops 2 review, for example. They praised the variable story based on your successes and failures). But they never even mentioned one of the biggest positives about the PMD games: The story. Those stories were the only ones ever to make me cry. Their bias comes from fat paychecks courtesy of Treyarch/Infinity Ward.

    Anyway, back on topic, the PMD games get bad reviews in my experience because of unfamiliarity of the genera and the graphics. The latter mainly falling on Time/Darkness/Sky.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Meeker View Post
    It was the first rougelike game I've played. And I rather like the PMD games. They hold SO many memories.
    me too, I love the games.

    I understand that the unfamiliarity of the game type is causing problems, but at least go out and beat Murky Cave/Marime Resort if you even want to rate anything. First Impressions are worth absolutely nothing.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kutie Pie View Post
    Maybe it's because it's a bit different? Which is odd, as a lot of Pokémon fans have always liked the idea of knowing what the Pokémon say, and to also know what they do. So personally, I think the Mystery Dungeon series has always been a wonderful idea. I like the idea of a questionnaire determining what Pokémon you'll be (usually different with each play-through), so there's no exact popular Pokémon people choose to be. The story is also really good (Explorers, anyway), and dark to boot. Seriously, outside of B/W, and possibly Platinum, when has the Pokémon series been this dark? I love that.

    So I don't know exactly why these games have mixed reviews, but who cares? They still sell well, and are fondly remembered by those who do like the games. It's the same with all of the other games. Whether these reviewers/critics get paid or not, it's all based on biased opinion. So if you like the games, that's fine. If someone doesn't like the games, that's fine, too (as long as they give reasons why they don't like the games). Opinions will be opinions.
    I agree to this. For me, possibly to others, the PMD series is Pokemon's own Legend of Zelda Ocarina of Time and Majoras Mask. I mean, I've read a creepy pasta where PMD Explorers coincides with Majora's Mask. And yes I'll say that Explorers is SO MUCH ABOUT DEATH AND LIFE. I mean, its all about your demise ... like who knows how many times the series go on the death rail?
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  18. #18

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    The reason it is my favorite game of all time is due to the fact that the story of red rescue team changed my life. I beat the game and was shocked by the ending, and cried for months. MONTHS. That's why I believe that sites like nintendo life (Who I was banned from as I like PMD and was flamed by the only mod) and NWR and IGN Don't even do a good job reviewing PMD Games.

    Seriously. On NWR'S Blue rescue team review, I read that you couldn't use moves, which brought the score down to a 5. WHAT THE HECK?

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    The new one for 3DS got a 38/40 from Famitsu, which is really good.
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    Quote Originally Posted by hawkmbl View Post
    The reason it is my favorite game of all time is due to the fact that the story of red rescue team changed my life. I beat the game and was shocked by the ending, and cried for months. MONTHS. That's why I believe that sites like nintendo life (Who I was banned from as I like PMD and was flamed by the only mod) and NWR and IGN Don't even do a good job reviewing PMD Games.

    Seriously. On NWR'S Blue rescue team review, I read that you couldn't use moves, which brought the score down to a 5. WHAT THE HECK?
    Ugh, seriosly. I hate it too. But they're getting paid to write bad revueiws on games that they aren't paid for. It's all bias.


    But, seriously, no moves? Arcues must use Judgement on them.


    But, really, you're better off reading reader reviews on Gamefaqs as they tend to not be a bunch of idiots who don't know how to open the menu.


    And about the ending thing, I cried too, but mostly because my partner decided to just leave and be a regular Pokémon it was heartbreaking.

  21. #21

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    It's just so sad that Xenoblade chronicles (Which in my opinion is a extremely overrated game) gets perfect scores for no reason, yet PMD's current metacritic score is in the 50 and 60 range... I hope that on Gonintendo's user reviews people actually review this one fairly.

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    Probably because it was too difficult for some, easy for others.
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    Probably because they found the gameplay repetitive and boring
    Which it is at times, but other things make up for it 10 fold

    And i agree, xenoblade is overrated
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fallen Icarus View Post
    Probably because they found the gameplay repetitive and boring
    Which it is at times, but other things make up for it 10 fold

    And i agree, xenoblade is overrated


    You can say that to EVERY game.

    Pokemon main games: It's really just poking the touch screen in battles. But you have to plan out the moves which makes it fun.

    Mario: Go left to right over and over again, and it's still a amazing game!

    So I don't personally believe in repetitiveness for those reasons. I'm still awaiting the day when PMD GTI gets a perfect score from a major source...

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    Quote Originally Posted by hawkmbl View Post
    You can say that to EVERY game.

    Pokemon main games: It's really just poking the touch screen in battles. But you have to plan out the moves which makes it fun.

    Mario: Go left to right over and over again, and it's still a amazing game!

    So I don't personally believe in repetitiveness for those reasons. I'm still awaiting the day when PMD GTI gets a perfect score from a major source...
    I agree with you on the repetitiveness of the main series Pokemon games, but Mario is different, I think, because it has different platforms and enemies and obstacles, whereas Pokemon Mystery Dungeon is basically a bunch of mazes with different Pokemon in them. I think PMD tends to get a bit repetitive and boring at times, but a lot of types of games have the same problem, so I'm not too harsh about it. And besides, I don't know how they could really fix that, anyway.
    Also, as much as I'm in love with the PMD series, I have to admit that it's not perfect. Probably about a 95/100 from me, but that's just my own opinion. It's mainly because they can be a little TOO unfair and luck-based than I would like. For example, when Primal Dialga happens to get a critical hit with Roar of Time when you're out of Reviver Seeds, so you have to do the fight again, only to have the exact same thing happen... well, it probably didn't happen twice to anyone else, but still. Not to mention Fury Swipes and other attacks that hit 2-5 times, doing about 15-20 damage for each one that hits. So let's say you have 100 HP. It just happens to be your unlucky day, so the opponent hits 5 times, doing 20 damage each time. Well, you're dead. You have to start the whole dungeon over, and all because of your luck. And I could go on and on about runaway outlaw missions with Ghost Pokemon who go through walls, or client Pokemon who get hit by Silver Wind or a similar move, etc, but I think everyone gets my point.
    As for the things I like about the games, well... I could list all of that, too, but it would be far too lengthy, so I'll try to sum it up. First of all, the storyline. Just this alone could be stretched out into about 7 paragraphs, to be honest. Especially in Time, Darkness, and Sky... wow. It has a plot twist. It has a ship that a lot of people agree with (Grovyle and shiny Celebi, anyone? Also, hero x partner is a huge deal here). It has loveable characters. Its ending is enough to make people cry no matter how many times they've played it. Heck, just being a Pokemon is great. Also, the music, and art style, and everything is just amazing, and if it weren't for a few gameplay flaws, I would say that it deserves a perfect score any day.
    Tl;dr: Pokemon Mystery Dungeon isn't perfect, but almost everything about it is. Even if people don't like the gameplay style, the storyline is enough to inspire countless fanfics, and if it got its own book, I would read it. I believe that it's a series that shouldn't be overlooked by anyone who calls themself a Pokemon fan (despite their possible doubts about the genre). And those bad reviews probably turn a lot of people off, unfortunately.
    Ah, yes, I probably just said something stupid there, didn't I? Not surprising, I've been called an idiot on multiple occasions, although I do consider myself to be more intelligent than most...

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