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Thread: Why the mixed reception in the PMD series?

  1. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Umbreon9 View Post
    I agree with you on the repetitiveness of the main series Pokemon games, but Mario is different, I think, because it has different platforms and enemies and obstacles, whereas Pokemon Mystery Dungeon is basically a bunch of mazes with different Pokemon in them. I think PMD tends to get a bit repetitive and boring at times, but a lot of types of games have the same problem, so I'm not too harsh about it. And besides, I don't know how they could really fix that, anyway.
    Also, as much as I'm in love with the PMD series, I have to admit that it's not perfect. Probably about a 95/100 from me, but that's just my own opinion. It's mainly because they can be a little TOO unfair and luck-based than I would like. For example, when Primal Dialga happens to get a critical hit with Roar of Time when you're out of Reviver Seeds, so you have to do the fight again, only to have the exact same thing happen... well, it probably didn't happen twice to anyone else, but still. Not to mention Fury Swipes and other attacks that hit 2-5 times, doing about 15-20 damage for each one that hits. So let's say you have 100 HP. It just happens to be your unlucky day, so the opponent hits 5 times, doing 20 damage each time. Well, you're dead. You have to start the whole dungeon over, and all because of your luck. And I could go on and on about runaway outlaw missions with Ghost Pokemon who go through walls, or client Pokemon who get hit by Silver Wind or a similar move, etc, but I think everyone gets my point.
    As for the things I like about the games, well... I could list all of that, too, but it would be far too lengthy, so I'll try to sum it up. First of all, the storyline. Just this alone could be stretched out into about 7 paragraphs, to be honest. Especially in Time, Darkness, and Sky... wow. It has a plot twist. It has a ship that a lot of people agree with (Grovyle and shiny Celebi, anyone? Also, hero x partner is a huge deal here). It has loveable characters. Its ending is enough to make people cry no matter how many times they've played it. Heck, just being a Pokemon is great. Also, the music, and art style, and everything is just amazing, and if it weren't for a few gameplay flaws, I would say that it deserves a perfect score any day.
    Tl;dr: Pokemon Mystery Dungeon isn't perfect, but almost everything about it is. Even if people don't like the gameplay style, the storyline is enough to inspire countless fanfics, and if it got its own book, I would read it. I believe that it's a series that shouldn't be overlooked by anyone who calls themselves a Pokemon fan (despite their possible doubts about the genre). And those bad reviews probably turn a lot of people off, unfortunately.
    agree to this wholeheartedly! You see, from my understanding, many players want to see the conflicts in great visual realistic details to bring them closer to the story and the game. I'd say the gameplay is actually very good. In each installment, they fix some of the many problems. I'd say chunsoft is a great second hand game developer. Indeed, this is my first pokemon game (PMD Rescue series) before I played the main series in third Generation.

    This is why his series has a very good possibly of being able to tackle storylines with very deep morals, characters, events and conflicts. I can share some of the grand conflicts of each series that is already released in USA. Dunno Japanese my apologies.

    a. In the Rescue Saga, you get to play the role of being a fugitive while EVERY RESCUE TEAM WILL HUNT YOU DOWN for a disastrous crime you did not cause. The uncontrollable natural calamities. There's also the common bullies issues at the start. Also, there is the painful moments of truth [learning the legend of Ninetales, Gengar is the trainer of the Gardevoir guiding you in your dreams, and your painful parting to your partner since destiny calls you back to becoming a human]. But the most impacting in this version is when you are in the theoretical purgatory after you and your pals died from the meteor. You DIED! Add the suspense of Gengar bringing you to the said shadow world, and I just piss my pants off (surprisingly in the close end, he saved you instead).

    b. In the Explorers saga, oh dear God. There is so much dark content that Rivals the story of Unova itself. One of them is seeing the approching death of Team Skull and never to be seen again [What I believe happened to them thanks to Kabutops], and the Sacrifice of Chatot just to save you two [I thought then that he is killed since it struck Wigglytuff very hard, until Grovyle says that he'll be fine]. The entire event of the dark future. The fact that there's something called the Planetary investigation here, I believe that there were humans at that time; only to be wiped out in the most gruesome way ever. Everything in the Dark Future in general. Seeing Manaphy be separated from you makes you feel terrible as a parent [not to mention manaphy sees you and your partner as its parents. Bonus points if they're a couple]. The rather depressing truth of Wigglytuff's childhood [who knew his first master was a criminal?! I never expected for him to be in such a high position in the guild thanks to being taught on how to explore by Armaldo: A criminal hunted by Magnazone and Nidoking in other terms].

    Last but not the least, the signature resolutions of every versions: when you disappear into the light. In rescue, you return to the human world. In Explorers, thanks to changing history, your existence is dead. you will DIE FOR REAL! The ultimate ingredient for crying moments best suited for eternal lovers [if your interpretation is that you married your partner as your wife/husband. Yeah: you're a human who turned to a pokemon to save the world and marry a pokemon in the end of the stooy], and strong/unbreakable friendships [this is more for platonic friendships that puts them to brotherhood or sisterhood]




    What I can say is that I think after Gates to Infinity, they may as well make a PMD game with a story inspired from Ni No Kuni: Wrath of the White Witch.
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  2. #27

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    Quote Originally Posted by jireh the provider View Post
    agree to this wholeheartedly! You see, from my understanding, many players want to see the conflicts in great visual realistic details to bring them closer to the story and the game. I'd say the gameplay is actually very good. In each installment, they fix some of the many problems. I'd say chunsoft is a great second hand game developer. Indeed, this is my first pokemon game (PMD Rescue series) before I played the main series in third Generation.

    This is why his series has a very good possibly of being able to tackle storylines with very deep morals, characters, events and conflicts. I can share some of the grand conflicts of each series that is already released in USA. Dunno Japanese my apologies.

    a. In the Rescue Saga, you get to play the role of being a fugitive while EVERY RESCUE TEAM WILL HUNT YOU DOWN for a disastrous crime you did not cause. The uncontrollable natural calamities. There's also the common bullies issues at the start. Also, there is the painful moments of truth [learning the legend of Ninetales, Gengar is the trainer of the Gardevoir guiding you in your dreams, and your painful parting to your partner since destiny calls you back to becoming a human]. But the most impacting in this version is when you are in the theoretical purgatory after you and your pals died from the meteor. You DIED! Add the suspense of Gengar bringing you to the said shadow world, and I just piss my pants off (surprisingly in the close end, he saved you instead).

    b. In the Explorers saga, oh dear God. There is so much dark content that Rivals the story of Unova itself. One of them is seeing the approching death of Team Skull and never to be seen again [What I believe happened to them thanks to Kabutops], and the Sacrifice of Chatot just to save you two [I thought then that he is killed since it struck Wigglytuff very hard, until Grovyle says that he'll be fine]. The entire event of the dark future. The fact that there's something called the Planetary investigation here, I believe that there were humans at that time; only to be wiped out in the most gruesome way ever. Everything in the Dark Future in general. Seeing Manaphy be separated from you makes you feel terrible as a parent [not to mention manaphy sees you and your partner as its parents. Bonus points if they're a couple]. The rather depressing truth of Wigglytuff's childhood [who knew his first master was a criminal?! I never expected for him to be in such a high position in the guild thanks to being taught on how to explore by Armaldo: A criminal hunted by Magnazone and Nidoking in other terms].

    Last but not the least, the signature resolutions of every versions: when you disappear into the light. In rescue, you return to the human world. In Explorers, thanks to changing history, your existence is dead. you will DIE FOR REAL! The ultimate ingredient for crying moments best suited for eternal lovers [if your interpretation is that you married your partner as your wife/husband. Yeah: you're a human who turned to a pokemon to save the world and marry a pokemon in the end of the stooy], and strong/unbreakable friendships [this is more for platonic friendships that puts them to brotherhood or sisterhood]




    What I can say is that I think after Gates to Infinity, they may as well make a PMD game with a story inspired from Ni No Kuni: Wrath of the White Witch.
    That's the main reason Both PMDS are 10 out of 10 IMO. The story and gameplay. It's so dark, and I love the games for that. Some things that aren't supposed to be in pkemon at all have been snuck in, the same way things were in SNES FFIII, Like suicidal mentions (Darkrai tells you in PMD2 via a nightmare that you and your partner would be better off "ending yourselves"), and death (Grovyle's brief death in PMD Sky's special episode, Your brief death in BOTH PMD1 and 2, and other implied references.

    Yet I still get sad whenever I see IGN or someone else give PMD a bad bashing, like how Gates to infinity is being called the worst PMD ever due to the lack of pokemon (Has anyone REALLY recruited all 492 pokemon in PMD2?), How PMD sky got a 4 out of 10 JUST For being too similar to time and darkness (Yet platinum is the same ordeal and it got a good rating..)

    Heck, ANYONE who rates Pokepark wii higher than any PMD game (Except Wiiware) is just confusing me more.

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    Quote Originally Posted by hawkmbl View Post
    That's the main reason Both PMDS are 10 out of 10 IMO. The story and gameplay. It's so dark, and I love the games for that. Some things that aren't supposed to be in pkemon at all have been snuck in, the same way things were in SNES FFIII, Like suicidal mentions (Darkrai tells you in PMD2 via a nightmare that you and your partner would be better off "ending yourselves"), and death (Grovyle's brief death in PMD Sky's special episode, Your brief death in BOTH PMD1 and 2, and other implied references.

    Yet I still get sad whenever I see IGN or someone else give PMD a bad bashing, like how Gates to infinity is being called the worst PMD ever due to the lack of pokemon (Has anyone REALLY recruited all 492 pokemon in PMD2?), How PMD sky got a 4 out of 10 JUST For being too similar to time and darkness (Yet platinum is the same ordeal and it got a good rating..)

    Heck, ANYONE who rates Pokepark wii higher than any PMD game (Except Wiiware) is just confusing me more.
    Yeah, Sky was a major improvement, though. It added Sky Peak, which was actually pretty fun to go through, and Spinda's Cafe potentially made the whole game a piece of cake. Not to mention the addition of Vulpix, Riolu, Shinx, Eevee, and Phanpy. And even little things, like being able to store all of your items by pressing two buttons rather than having to do it manually.
    As for Gates to Infinity... Well, I can't say much since I've only played the demo, but the lack of Pokemon shouldn't be a problem. And did they really expect all 649 Pokemon to fit in the game, anyway? Although I will admit that the lack of starters is a bit disappointing, I think that if they were nitpicking that much, they could've found something to complain about besides that obvious thing. They could've said that they didn't like the grid style, or that they didn't like going through the Magnagates as Pikachu because its only attacking move was Thundershock, etc. It's clear that they really didn't even try when they were reviewing these games.
    Ah, yes, I probably just said something stupid there, didn't I? Not surprising, I've been called an idiot on multiple occasions, although I do consider myself to be more intelligent than most...

  4. #29

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    Quote Originally Posted by Umbreon9 View Post
    Yeah, Sky was a major improvement, though. It added Sky Peak, which was actually pretty fun to go through, and Spinda's Cafe potentially made the whole game a piece of cake. Not to mention the addition of Vulpix, Riolu, Shinx, Eevee, and Phanpy. And even little things, like being able to store all of your items by pressing two buttons rather than having to do it manually.
    As for Gates to Infinity... Well, I can't say much since I've only played the demo, but the lack of Pokemon shouldn't be a problem. And did they really expect all 649 Pokemon to fit in the game, anyway? Although I will admit that the lack of starters is a bit disappointing, I think that if they were nitpicking that much, they could've found something to complain about besides that obvious thing. They could've said that they didn't like the grid style, or that they didn't like going through the Magnagates as Pikachu because its only attacking move was Thundershock, etc. It's clear that they really didn't even try when they were reviewing these games.
    At least famitsu is sane. They gave the game a 38 out of 40 due to it's content and story. I fear that next week the reviews for GTI will be bad for silly reasons...

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    I looooved these games! But I get why some people didn't like 'em very much I mean the storylines aren't that original & the game play does gets repetitive after a while. I learned to live with it and I kept playing the games anyways just because they seemed re-freshing to me after playing the main RPGs but not everyone likes the same thing. But to me PMD are a great series of games.

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    Well the first eshop rating is up... And it's 4 stars out of 5.

    And before you think: "That's a great score!" It's not. Usually games with 4 star rating are in the B-C Range, which could be a bad thing.

    And Luigi's mansion 2 somehow has 3 5 star ratings... Even though it looks horribly easy and short like the first one.

    But what confuses me on this Eshop rating is what play styles they picked.

    "Is this game meant for everyone or for gamers?" They choose everyone, which COULD make some little sense I suppose.

    But what is REALLY confusing is "Is this game style intense or casual?", and they chose CASUAL.

    How can PMD be casual? The later dungeons are very brutal and hard, and it can frustrate you to no end.

    Makes me fear that we'll get 7 out of 10 and below ratings soon... If I see IGN give this a 4 out of 10 again I'm just gonna not be happy.

  7. #32

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    The new game's reviews are going all over the place. Game informer and Gameradar gave it bad scores (5 and 6 out of 10s), While Nintendo world report and Destructoid gave it a 8.

  8. #33
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    Virtually all of the reviews are bashing the gameplay and little else (Though I'm assuming those people probably didn't play the previous entries).

    Which isn't anything new for the series, since roguelikes are a real "like it or hate it" kind of genre.

  9. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by hawkmbl View Post
    Well the first eshop rating is up... And it's 4 stars out of 5.

    And before you think: "That's a great score!" It's not. Usually games with 4 star rating are in the B-C Range, which could be a bad thing.

    And Luigi's mansion 2 somehow has 3 5 star ratings... Even though it looks horribly easy and short like the first one.

    But what confuses me on this Eshop rating is what play styles they picked.

    "Is this game meant for everyone or for gamers?" They choose everyone, which COULD make some little sense I suppose.

    But what is REALLY confusing is "Is this game style intense or casual?", and they chose CASUAL.

    How can PMD be casual? The later dungeons are very brutal and hard, and it can frustrate you to no end.

    Makes me fear that we'll get 7 out of 10 and below ratings soon... If I see IGN give this a 4 out of 10 again I'm just gonna not be happy.
    Everyone, well, it can be enjoyed by everyone, I mean, my lil sis (who really never games) loves the Demo.

    And, casual, most of it really is casual, and the postgame dungeons, like Purity Forest and Destiny Tower, while they aren't a cakewalk, aren't intense. All you need to do is sit, think, and play. And as they don't have quicksave before the dungeons, theres no shame in restarting.

  10. #35

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    OK... IGN just crossed the line.

    THEY GAVE GTI A 4.5 OUT OF TEN.

    And why? Because the story is "too childish" (The ending is brutal to the heart), and the gameplay is "too dull." It makes no sense!

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    Quote Originally Posted by hawkmbl View Post
    OK... IGN just crossed the line.

    THEY GAVE GTI A 4.5 OUT OF TEN.

    And why? Because the story is "too childish" (The ending is brutal to the heart), and the gameplay is "too dull." It makes no sense!
    He does have some good points, like the tensity that's gone with the removal of Hunger, the awful text speed, the horrendous AI, and how absolute bullcrap it is that the game has Day 1 DLC, but they're offset by a few things that he's just plain wrong about.

    1. This game is apparently harder than the previous titles. Apparently he didn't get very far in the others.
    2. I praised his pointing out how removing Hunger ruined some of the game's tensity, but... then he stated that they added in PP to replace Hunger. Apparently PP wasn't in the previous games.
    3. I guess his version of the game didn't come with Companion Mode, because he seems to think that you only get to control one Pokemon throughout the entire game.

    Even if we pretend the above three things were true, it's a harsh final score. This game is by no means better than the previous PMDs (my opinion), but it's at least a 7.
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    Hunger was more a nuisance than anything IMO. The story isn't as good as the previous entries but I still like it. The way moves work and dungeon crawling is so much better than the last PMDs though

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    I didn't think anyone would actually say the original PMD had a better story then this one. The pacing in that one felt really off, as there was literally no build up to the final dungeon. They just threw it at you after an unrelated story arc.

    On the other hand, this game has the most build-up before the finale out of all of them, and it really makes you feel relieved once you've finished the story. I honestly feel too emotionally drained after it to do much of anything right now, even some six hours later...

  14. #39

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    This story was so amazing... I actually cried during a game for the first time in seven years playing this game... With everything new added and fixed, I give this a 10 out of 10 IMO.

    BTW, The text isn't that bad... It complements the story, and it's not nearly as much as Virtue's last reward had.

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    Wow just WoW.

    IGN is just IGN itself. But all of us should know that they don't usually count the experience as a way to rate game.

    From what I see in their rating process, it has to do with the average consumer than the dedicated consumer in most cases. Though they could review it for hardcore ones, most of the time, they experience they rate in the game is oftentimes the teenagers and adults for it's rare that a reviewer even cares for a rookie (newcomer in video games)

    Keep in mind that they always have a motive that says "First glimpses are the elements that tell everything in entertainment." for many times, this is true. But I believe the reviewers of IGN just ignored looking at the deeper aspects for not every video game has its true core represented in the start .. it could be in the middle or the end.

    Just for now, I'm on the fence on buying this game this time (gates to infinity) ever since I'm watching Marriland's PMD walkthrough. But I can't help but also get it before the end of April since I can get a free code to download Professor Layton and the Miracle Mask.

    For me, the story is redeeming .. but for now, I might give this game a pass away and wait for X and Y.

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  16. #41

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    Quote Originally Posted by jireh the provider View Post
    Wow just WoW.

    IGN is just IGN itself. But all of us should know that they don't usually count the experience as a way to rate game.

    From what I see in their rating process, it has to do with the average consumer than the dedicated consumer in most cases. Though they could review it for hardcore ones, most of the time, they experience they rate in the game is oftentimes the teenagers and adults for it's rare that a reviewer even cares for a rookie (newcomer in video games)

    Keep in mind that they always have a motive that says "First glimpses are the elements that tell everything in entertainment." for many times, this is true. But I believe the reviewers of IGN just ignored looking at the deeper aspects for not every video game has its true core represented in the start .. it could be in the middle or the end.

    Just for now, I'm on the fence on buying this game this time (gates to infinity) ever since I'm watching Marriland's PMD walkthrough. But I can't help but also get it before the end of April since I can get a free code to download Professor Layton and the Miracle Mask.

    For me, the story is redeeming .. but for now, I might give this game a pass away and wait for X and Y.

    Grammar lesson:
    might = less likely
    may = more likely
    The fact that they fail to mention companion mode and DLC is just insulting, too

  17. #42
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    This question has actually been rattling around in my head for awhile. I enjoy the PMD series, but I've personally felt that the series has gone slightly downhill. There are many things I like about the series, but as the series has progressed, some of those things have been removed.

    Red/Blue Rescue - I loved that you were actually playing your story. In the other games, I felt more like a sidekick than anything else. I also loved the Friend Areas. I liked being able to visit the habitats of the different pokemon. Being able to recruit all the pokemon. In the future games, as the numbers went up, the recruitable pokemon decreased, even if only slightly. The rescue base. I liked developing my own rescue base and I thought it was a good feature even if it was only superficial.

    Explorers Time/Darkness/Sky - Yes, It had a more involved story which I enjoyed, but like I said, I felt more like a sidekick. I didn't actually feel any link to the character I was supposed to be playing. I also liked the idea of an adventurers guild, but I thought it was wasted. Despite being a part of this world famous guild, after the initial appeal wore off, I found myself being more annoyed with the waking up process of every new day. I definitely loved the addition of the wanted board, especially with magnezone as the police. I also enjoyed the special missions that slowly became available as you were introduced, but as fun as the missions were, I wasn't very attached to many of the characters to begin with.

    Gates to Infinity - Decreased amount of starter pokemon, what the hell... I will admit, I was slightly happy that they removed the "magical" quiz that determined your species, because like everyone else, I just reset until I got what I wanted. But seriously, that was a downer. I haven't completed this game yet, but once again, I'm feeling more like a sidekick than a main character. Chargeable DLC... seriously... I've only bought 2 so far, but you're telling me that couldn't have been included with the game. Graphics are great sure. I liked the idea of building your own "paradise", but I typically avoid it because I don't keep track of which stores are which. Then the Hunger... what the hell... I'm not saying it was a great feature, but man did it make me plan ahead before going into a dungeon. I don't even bother taking any items with me into dungeons anymore. Next, reducing your missions to only 1 at a time?!?!? I used to go into dungeons with 4-5 quests under my belt all ranging in difficulties. Now I'm stuck doing 1 and only 1 quest at any given time. The shared experience... I now have absolutely no reason to train any other pokemon, because they're automatically leveled up. I will admit, giving the moves power levels was interesting. Not being able to nickname certain characters... I typically use nicknames to keep track of which pokemon I recruit, and with some of them not nicknamed, my rosters looks weird. Lastly, the V-wheel, I thought that was an interesting feature.

    As I said, I enjoy the Mystery Dungeon series, but personally I've felt that the series has progressively gone downhill. That could be one of the causes of the mixed reception that the games receive. If they combined the best features of the series, I think the game quality would vastly improve.
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    I played EoS myself(though I'm only at the arc of that Desert Dungeon), but so far, I did find it a lot similar to EoT & D and even though there were some differences(the special episodes and the cafe, and the cafe only had a few different qualities that didn't give any interest), but I did find it good though. That must be the reason why people must've disliked the game. Explorers of Time and Darkness was good and the arc was longer than Red/Blue Rescue Team, and we get to fight an even more harder opponent than Rayquaza. But, Red/Blue rescue team in my opinion was more emotional. I mean, I didn't finish Blue but Red, but by the time I saw myself glowing and leaving, I literally cried, because of all the people that cared and for what's going on.


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    Well my opinion why the mixed reception is because it really changed the view (IMO) on the series overall, even if it's just a spinoff. It has an intense and really nice storyline which is, again in my opinion, better than some of the mainstream games. There's also the fact that in a way you kinda feel like your part of it and the mechanics is though can be a bit boring, quite fun. The game is also filled with suspense. It's also a pretty good idea really, really creative and a lot of people as far as I know who play this really like this game that some of them make fan fics, comics, art and stuff like that based on it. I haven't heard really of negative comments on this but I admit, I too had quite some mixed reactions playing this but it was mostly positive on my case so that's I guess why.
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    I really don't care much about the critics, The best way to know about how good and bad the game is to play it, I played Explorers of the Sky, and really i love it. As well, I don't believe in the critics so much, it reminds me like the tier lists from Super Smash Bros series, every people have different idea and likes.
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    I believe that the game takes too much time before players can see how much they can utilize the system, especially the training the moves.

  22. #47

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    Apparently European reviews think the same thing that US reviewers do... Giving it low scores... I don't get it.

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