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Thread: Could the Best Wishes Saga been different if the TR VS TP episodes weren't canceled?

  1. #26
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    Not for me. I disliked Best Wishes after about 10-13 episodes. I just didn't like the overall direction the series took in gen 5 and Team Plasma couldn't save it for me. It still wouldn't erase BW Ash, the absence of a secondary quest, repetitive Pokemon personalities, and the trashy regression stuff. Even if Team Plasma was around it wouldn't have saved the anime for me, just like N, Team Plasma, and Charizard can't save BW for me now.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dephender View Post
    In DP we went almost 70 episodes before seeing Galactic for more than a few seconds, and another 30 episodes until we got a proper introduction to their plot. This is no different.
    I see. Thanks for clarifying that detail.
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  3. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cresselia92 View Post
    I see. Thanks for clarifying that detail.
    Also, again: Team Rocket was serving the serious antagonistic role. Until that was done, complete with a finale before the League featuring the evil team leader (the one that's currently airing in the English dub right now), Team Plasma had no place in the story. So considering that, I don't think it's weird they'd disappear for over 80 episodes at all.
    Last edited by AgentPierce; 20th January 2013 at 5:58 AM.

  4. #29
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    More or less, I suppose the best we could have gotten from having these 2-part episodes appear would to answer the plot hole questions we were left with. Because of that, the US dub (and Japan I think) had to move things around. So there wouldn't be any future time contradictions. Especially with the Fishing Tournament episode being completely useless and easily forgettable. As well as knowing for sure what had happened to Pierce (a very promising character). And of course, no 2 part episodes meant no Looker and that was a travesty in itself.

    However, looking at the new opening we go... could it be that the anime is attempting to piece back the Team Plasma raid in Castelia City? Which was what these 2 part episodes were meant to be. Only difference is their new uniforms and a Genesect Army led by a Shiny one (Movie 16 key).

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  5. #30
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    I think people are putting too much weight into two episodes.

    Figured it was supposed to play out something like this: Team Rocket came away victorious in Rocket VS Plasma because they struck a few months before the Sages were ready to act. Plasma goes into hiding to regroup, rebuild, and finally go get N. Meanwhile Team Rocket sets up shop in Unova thinking they're unopposed and lay the groundwork for Project Tempest.

    The reason we didn't see Plasma anymore immediately after the two parters or even leading up to the Unova League was because they were forced back into hiding by Team Rocket. After Team Rocket left the region Team Plasma thought it was safe to act.

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    It's Pokemon

    For the life of me I don't understand why people are expecting some groundbreaking plot that would have changed the anime as we know it. It would have been the same lame evil team plot that we have been getting since the show started.

    Really, what could you possibly expect from an anime like Pokemon?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Verdant View Post
    When the episodes got postponed everything related to Team Plasma got removed. Which means that we don't know what role Team Plasma would have had.

    For all we know more episodes about Team Plasma were supposed to be aired but got removed after the two parter got postponed. Hell they easily could have tweaked some existing episodes to remove anything Team Plasma related.
    Yeah. You can even tell that some of the fillers that followed those eps seemed kinda rushed, almost like they had to scramble to write them up.

    Although despite the removal of those episodes, I still enjoyed BW's anime, moreso than any of the other seasons (overall, at least).

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    Quote Originally Posted by Platinum fan. View Post
    Not for me. I disliked Best Wishes after about 10-13 episodes.
    I felt the same way to be honest. I just couldn't enjoy BW after the first dozen episodes. I kept telling myself that the plot would pick up, but by the 20th episode or so I had officially given up on it; the Gothitelle episode was really the last episode I enjoyed, and that was partly because it seemed so absurd and I had a great time making fun of the plot. The two banned episodes seemed kind of interesting at the time, but my faith in the anime wouldn't have been restored even if they had aired because I knew they wouldn't be groundbreaking. I think they're overrated now; they only seem like a big deal to us because they haven't aired and there's still an air of mystery around them. Mystique, basically.

  9. #34
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    As we can't really see these episodes, I think any opinion on this would be pure especulation. We just can't know what would have happened if those episodes were aired. I hope that Episode N will be as good as it seems to be.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lucas MV View Post
    As we can't really see these episodes, I think any opinion on this would be pure especulation. We just can't know what would have happened if those episodes were aired. I hope that Episode N will be as good as it seems to be.
    There's a chance they still might play those episodes

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    Quote Originally Posted by Super-Staff View Post
    Yeah. You can even tell that some of the fillers that followed those eps seemed kinda rushed, almost like they had to scramble to write them up.
    Like what? Because ALL the fillers following the eps and before Nimbasa City were already written before the disaster struck.

    There was no "scrambling to write things up", that's not how it works in the TV business. People need to get this through their heads already.

    Quote Originally Posted by AhTreyYou View Post
    There's a chance they still might play those episodes
    True, but they'll be retconned into current continuity and the end result tweaked a little (probably so that TR is the big loser of the fight, not TP.)
    Last edited by AgentPierce; 20th January 2013 at 6:03 AM.

  12. #37
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    I think those two episodes will be tweaked and made into the finale of the N arc and be the lead into the movie which will hopefully be the grand finale since I'm guessing the episodes with Red Genesect will happen prior to the movie.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pokemaniac24 View Post
    For all we know, they planned it from the start that TP would show up in those 2 episodes and then not return until after the League. It seemed to me like they wanted to focus more on TR in BW and BW2.
    We don't know that. You just think that. TP could appear after those 2 episodes, but right after that they just removed some of the episode where they appear.

    Like someone says, until an official source tells us, we don't know what was really going to happen.
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  14. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by IcySealeo View Post
    We don't know that. You just think that. TP could appear after those 2 episodes, but right after that they just removed some of the episode where they appear.

    Like someone says, until an official source tells us, we don't know what was really going to happen.
    Clearly you didn't read what AgentPierce said nor have any idea of how TV production works.

    Unless you don't know what "for all we know" means.
    Last edited by Pokemaniac24; 20th January 2013 at 7:43 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by IcySealeo View Post
    We don't know that. You just think that. TP could appear after those 2 episodes, but right after that they just removed some of the episode where they appear.

    Like someone says, until an official source tells us, we don't know what was really going to happen.
    Well unless they replaced the TP episodes with TR, your wrong.
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  16. #41
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    You don't understand that no matter what you will say we can't decide until an official source will tell us so. So nobody's wrong and nobody's right.
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  17. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by IcySealeo View Post
    You don't understand that no matter what you will say we can't decide until an official source will tell us so. So nobody's wrong and nobody's right.
    You're the one who on the first post of this thread besides the thread maker said that yes the show would have been completely different. Where is your evidence for that?

  18. #43
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    Not really, Team Rocket vs Team Plasma is like the climax/conclusion for the Meteonite arc. After all, Best Wishes saga would've aired them sooner if that were the case much like they easily did with the fishing episode.

    Its for Team Plasma's debut, all episodes focused on Team Rocket again and the subway arc. So if anything, they weren't set to appear for awhile with no episodes focused on them after. I wouldn't be surprised if they actually waited for BW2, for Team Plasma to appear again.

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    Quote Originally Posted by IcySealeo View Post
    You don't understand that no matter what you will say we can't decide until an official source will tell us so. So nobody's wrong and nobody's right.
    This is all that can be said, hopefully it'll be answerered just like the GS Ball was.

    However, in the meantime... We may have a tonne of evidence that suggest nothing changed, but I can't help but feel the saga would have turned out differently.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ash&Pikachu-Fan View Post
    Not really, Team Rocket vs Team Plasma is like the climax/conclusion for the Meteonite arc. After all, Best Wishes saga would've aired them sooner if that were the case much like they easily did with the fishing episode.

    Its for Team Plasma's debut, all episodes focused on Team Rocket again and the subway arc. So if anything, they weren't set to appear for awhile with no episodes focused on them after. I wouldn't be surprised if they actually waited for BW2, for Team Plasma to appear again.
    I wouldn't be surprised that they knew about B2W2 at that point as well.. Well, in the sense that they probably meant that they weren't going to show them after BW24 until this arc from the very beginning, not that they postponed anything or whatnot..

    They played it smart. Have a short moment in which you show the evil team, but have them fail, but show them return again at a later point. Best way to build the hype...
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  21. #46
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    Of course it would have been different. For starters, we would have had 2 more episodes to look forward to, both of them would be very important for Tr and Tp.

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    I really doubt anything would have been different. Team Rocket had a big enough role following the arc so there's no reason to assume Plasma were going to stay in the spotlight for more than two episodes. The fact that TRio switched straight back to their white uniforms and never heard from Giovanni again during the first season of Best Wishes also suggests little to no Plasma activity. Of course, Plasma could have operated without TR getting involved (much) later on in the series but I doubt it given the size of TRio's role.

    The way things are currently going right now is more or less the same as DP. Galactic had their little two parter during the first season, then they didn't do their full story until Platinum had been released.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SlimeStack View Post
    The way things are currently going right now is more or less the same as DP. Galactic had their little two parter during the first season, then they didn't do their full story until Platinum had been released.
    Pretty sure Team Galactic had their first two parter at the end of season 2, around the same time operation tempest happened in BW

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    Quote Originally Posted by Verdant View Post
    Pretty sure Team Galactic had their first two parter at the end of season 2, around the same time operation tempest happened in BW
    I was thinking of A Secret Sphere of Influence when I said that. So Team Galactic did appear in some form in the first season before coming back in full form later. Plasma's debut was just planned to be bigger.

  25. #50
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    Of course the anime could have been different!!

    Things that could have been:

    1. With Team Plasma introduced early in the anime Krokorok could have been captured early.
    2. The reserve mons like Unfezant, Palpitoad, Boldore could all received more screen time!
    3. With more battles some pokemon could have evolved early or at least evolved (For Ex. Snivy...or even Oshawott)
    4. Team Rocket could have appear more to battle or confront Team Plasma
    5. Ash could have battle Drayden for the final badge (Because he knows about the legendary dragons, and Iris could also received her episodes too)
    6. Iris and Cilan could have received more team changes, they need something to battle plasma with!!
    7. An arc in which Ash bond with the light stone and summon Reshiram (We know N is an idealism....)
    8. The dragonspiral tower could have been introduced...even include Georgia in the twist!!!
    9. Taking one of Bianca's mon could make a great character development!!
    10. A mon of the crew switching teams ala Gigi could have been awesome (Ex. Emolga could be incredible)
    11. The league could have been more pace to include team Plasma and N

    If they need a filler arc they could have done one with The world tournament, which could have been the great opportunity to bring all characters like Brock, Misty, Gary, Dawn..etc! and they could also include the Neo Plasma!! So know we got a filler arc only focus on Neo Plasma and not a single goal for ash...which kind of weird for my taste!!

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