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Thread: Immersion: Plot and gamer segregation

  1. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nyarlathotep View Post
    Someone said that the protagonists in Pokémon aren't mean to be us. That is a completely equivocated statement IMO. They don't speak because we are meant to give them personalities and thoughts. They have official names, because we need them to refer to the characters and not any other reason. Just picture how lame would be to call Red as "Gen I protagonist" and Dawn as "Gen IV female protagonist". Seriously.

    tl;dr: IMO, voiced protagonists are lame and really hurt the experience in any RPG game. IMO, chatty protagonists always seem to break immersion for me by saying things that I'd rather not. This kind of protagonist is perfect for adventure games, like 999, Ace Attorney, etc, but NOT for RPGs. Personally, I hope more silent protagonists emerge. If they ever change silent protagonists to chatty wimps in Pokémon I'll certainly quit playing.
    It baffles me how some people can insist that the characters aren't you. The Professor at the start of the game asks for your gender and your name. Keeping in mind that Pokémon's target audience is (somewhat) children, I have several younger relatives who play Pokémon, each of them use their real names. I can't imagine a 10 year old kid starting his new game on Pokémon Black and choosing the female character, naming her 'Touko.' I'm sure a decent handful Pokémon fans out there are excited for possibilities of character customization in X and Y because it will make your in-game character feel even more like yourself, at least that's why I'm so excited about it.

    So I agree with you 100% Nyar, voiced protagonists do damage the role playing experience of an RPG and are better suited for games like Ace Attorney. How would Ace Attorney even work if Nick were a silent protagonist?
    Black 2 FC - 2237 5230 0474

  2. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Super Llama View Post
    It baffles me how some people can insist that the characters aren't you. The Professor at the start of the game asks for your gender and your name. Keeping in mind that Pokémon's target audience is (somewhat) children, I have several younger relatives who play Pokémon, each of them use their real names. I can't imagine a 10 year old kid starting his new game on Pokémon Black and choosing the female character, naming her 'Touko.' I'm sure a decent handful Pokémon fans out there are excited for possibilities of character customization in X and Y because it will make your in-game character feel even more like yourself, at least that's why I'm so excited about it.
    Good points. Some aspects of the game support the idea of you being the protagonist. Also, I can say I am one of the fans who I'd love the possibility of making the main character look like me.
    There hasn't be a single one that look slightly like me, only some NPCs and I am sure the same goes for a lot of players. Btw, nice to see you agree.

    Quote Originally Posted by Super Llama View Post
    How would Ace Attorney even work if Nick were a silent protagonist?
    Haha. I wonder. Adventure games like Ace Attorney are basically "interactive films", so it is hard to imagine this genre of games working well with silent protagonists.

  3. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dragontail View Post
    YES, I honestly have played the game through. What I MEANT was the after-game missions, where you help an NPC with something,like clearing logs out of the path.

    Seriously, have you actually read a post clearly?
    You say something different than your intention, then accuse me of misreading?

    also most of the post-game is Rangers is those challenge facility dealies and legendaries, so even then

    Quote Originally Posted by Nyarlathotep View Post
    You don't have to defeat anyone or get anything. You just happen to be in the wrong places at the wrong times. Like was said, these are cases of severe unluckiness.
    I wouldn't necessarily put it like that. While you do manage to show up at around the time when an evil team is carrying out an evil plot, I would attribute that more to the fact that as the protagonist, your mission is to travel the Pokeworld, seeking out challenges and experiences in your quest to be the best damn Pokemon Master ever. Because of that, coming into contact with a villainous team is inevitable; if you don't stumble upon them in your endless questing, someone who knows how well you battle will ask you to defeat them on their behalf.

    Quote Originally Posted by Nyarlathotep View Post
    Protagonists with "fixed personality" don't really work well for RPG... The best RPG series in my opinion have this feature (Shin Megami Tensei, Pokémon, Persona, Dragon Quest, EarthBound, Chrono Trigger).
    but

    Xenoblade

  4. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Excitable Boy View Post
    I wouldn't necessarily put it like that. While you do manage to show up at around the time when an evil team is carrying out an evil plot, I would attribute that more to the fact that as the protagonist, your mission is to travel the Pokeworld, seeking out challenges and experiences in your quest to be the best damn Pokemon Master ever. Because of that, coming into contact with a villainous team is inevitable; if you don't stumble upon them in your endless questing, someone who knows how well you battle will ask you to defeat them on their behalf.
    Hmm... Yeah.

    Quote Originally Posted by Excitable Boy View Post
    but

    Xenoblade
    I've never played Xenoblade, but it may be the exception that proves the rule.
    Also, a lot of people consider it one of the best RPG in the existence, but I can't say the same, since, as I said, I didn't play it yet.

  5. #30
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    Well as I previously stated, the characters are silent for the reason of allowing players to pretend they are the protagonist of this adventure, it's been stated by Game Freak already.

    But regardless, the beauty and simplicity of the main PKMN games is that even if the story or character motivations becomes more complex they are still relatively straightforward to understand, with a fairly guided run-through.

    It allows those who believe they're simply an unlucky trainer who got caught up in all the craziness to play the games as such, and those who believe they are a fated hero to play as such too.

    Quote Originally Posted by Raguna
    Pokémon really doesn't need the "chosen one" notion, that's why it never had that. I mean, when have you ever heard someone saying you had a "destiny" to fulfill in Pokémon games?
    It's never outright stated, but I think there are subtle hints, especially in the case of Platinum and B/W with Giratina and N, respectively. But as I said above, it's just a matter of which perspective the player wishes to have and play out.

    Quote Originally Posted by Excitable Boy
    While you do manage to show up at around the time when an evil team is carrying out an evil plot, I would attribute that more to the fact that as the protagonist, your mission is to travel the Pokeworld, seeking out challenges and experiences in your quest to be the best damn Pokemon Master ever. Because of that, coming into contact with a villainous team is inevitable; if you don't stumble upon them in your endless questing, someone who knows how well you battle will ask you to defeat them on their behalf.
    That is the general feel of the games and the core concept, but with newer games bringing more of a narrative I think it makes it harder to have a silent character with a blank background. Especially since as a trainer you're not meant to be anything more than an average 10yr old (aside from the catching monsters thing lol, very average).


    On another not, here's a discussion I found another forum, one of the peeps there makes a good point that PKMN hasn't got a team of other characters to do the talking or exposition for the protagonist, which is probably what makes all the dialogue very tedious in the Gen V games.


    Round and Round and Round he goes~

  6. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pasque View Post
    Yeah, the scripted story and dialogue has become quite intrusive to the gameplay. I also enjoy expanding on an overall plot and characters but not to the extent where it affects your options of what to do next.
    I guess the best way to describe it is 'guided'. You're guided to your next destination or adventure, and it's been like this in all the Gens, but B/W definitely brought it to a new level of intrusiveness.
    "Guided"... Yes, I think that's the perfect word to describe how I feel the games have become. A lot of it feels like someone is holding your hand through it rather than you making the choices yourself. It does tend to separate you from the game, which may be why the last 2 generations, while still really good, have never really immersed me quite as much as R/S and their predecessors. But like I said, I still enjoy what their doing with the story and would like to keep that around.
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