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Thread: Is the BW series doing gimmick things to have more ratings? Are they desesperate?

  1. #76
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    Quote Originally Posted by CyberCubed View Post
    So will the grand total of 30 seconds of screentime Misty/Brock get in the flashback sequence.
    I think thats more fanservice for older viewers. There are plenty of good scenes without either one of them.

    or they could be edited out XD but I think the rage from youtube and deviant art would have killed the internet

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    Quote Originally Posted by CyberCubed View Post
    So will the grand total of 30 seconds of screentime Misty/Brock get in the flashback sequence.
    it might be even less than that lol
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doryuzu View Post
    So, if these gimmicks are gimmicks.(Advertisement, the whole point of this show) I guess the Notch-Eared Pichu, May returns, the Johto Festa, Swinub's quick evolution(Pokemon Platinum advertisement!!!!1111), The Rotom episode, the introduction of Looker, Ursula showing up with Pikachu's Hoenn cousins, and the return of old Pokemon in the league were gimmicks too? I guess those don't count since they were separated by the immense amount of bland fillers in DP.

    Also, anime nerds are not the "true" fans because they are not the target audience.
    It depends on what you consider a gimmick in the anime. I was merely expressing my disappointment with things that are hyped months before they happen in the anime to shamelessly increase ratings, which has become a problem recently. Some of the things that you listed like Swinub's evolution and Ursula with Minun and Plusle happened without much fanfare, so I don't count them as gimmicks. I'm not arguing against all forms of promotion, just those that are done to make up for the fact that BW's ratings have been free falling for about two years now.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ciccone View Post
    It depends on what you consider a gimmick in the anime. I was merely expressing my disappointment with things that are hyped months before they happen in the anime to shamelessly increase ratings, which has become a problem recently. Some of the things that you listed like Swinub's evolution and Ursula with Minun and Plusle happened without much fanfare, so I don't count them as gimmicks. I'm not arguing against all forms of promotion, just those that are done to make up for the fact that BW's ratings have been free falling for about two years now.
    The ratings for BW are perfectly fine, the show's ratings have been on a steady decline since it began back in OS, no succeeding saga's ratings have been better than the one before it. This isn't exclusive to Pokemon, every show in Japan's ratings are slowly but surely dropping due to a combination of less people watching TV and less childbirth in Japan overall. The producers of Pokemon don't care about ratings, they do care about merchandising because that's where their priorities and money lie mainly. Mewtwo and Charizard were not brought back with the intentions of increasing ratings, this show could have pitiful ratings and it would still continue on if the merchandise sold heavily. Dragon Ball Kai in Japan got massive ratings but the show got canned after 100 episodes due to no one actually buying the merchandise. I'm almost 100% Charizard and Mewtwo were not brought back for ratings, more so because said Pokemon are popular Gen 1 Pokemon that the producers can cash on due to the innumerable amounts of stuff they could produce en masse, market and sell. The same could be said of Genesect, Dragonite, Oshawott, Snivy, Pikachu, Emolga, and just about every other Pokemon on the main cast. At the end of the day ratings have nothing to do with any of this which is why I think it's very odd people keep citing ratings as a motive for the recent happenings in BW. Swinub's speedy evolution and Ursula's Hoenn mouse duo were most certainly done for advertising but since this thread seems to think that "gimmick" is synonymous with "advertisement" I just decided to point that out.
    Last edited by Doryuzu; 2nd March 2013 at 5:29 AM.

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    Yeah Ratings are a bit tough to judge now compared to before. In the 90s-early 2000's everyone watched tv. But as technology has increased, there's even people who don't even watch tv anymore.

    It's really interesting when you realize how the simplest things can be so different after a decade or so




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    Quote Originally Posted by TheFonz View Post
    Yeah Ratings are a bit tough to judge now compared to before. In the 90s-early 2000's everyone watched tv. But as technology has increased, there's even people who don't even watch tv anymore.

    It's really interesting when you realize how the simplest things can be so different after a decade or so
    Actually, I check ratings weekly for new episodes of Pokemon and various other anime. The ratings are perfectly fine and even then the ratings only account for certain age groups of peoples, specifically children to see if they're watching. The increments are, iirc, 2-11, 6-11, 9-14, and that's that really. Anyone else that's watching really doesn't mean much of anything for ratings since advertisers only buy air time for shows that are being watched prominently by children for Pokemon to advertise their latest kiddie toy or childish new thing.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Doryuzu View Post
    Actually, I check ratings weekly for new episodes of Pokemon and various other anime. The ratings are perfectly fine and even then the ratings only account for certain age groups of peoples, specifically children to see if they're watching. The increments are, iirc, 2-11, 6-11, 9-14, and that's that really. Anyone else that's watching really doesn't mean much of anything for ratings since advertisers only buy air time for shows that are being watched prominently by children for Pokemon to advertise their latest kiddie toy or childish new thing.
    I was siding with you. I meant that since less people watch tv that you can't say the older episodes had better ratings.

    Like how pennies, nickels, and dimes used to be a lot more useful years ago. That kind of thing




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    Quote Originally Posted by TheFonz View Post
    Like how pennies, nickels, and dimes used to be a lot more useful years ago. That kind of thing
    That's actually a very very accurate way of describing it.

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    Although I do see a bit of a difference in how they market certain Pokémon now. The way Piplup and Oshawott get shoved in our faces. I can't think of any Pokémon like that before DP. One could argue Psyduck, but even then it's in a different league than those two. Maybe Togepi, but it didn't have as much focus

    Although Axew is a bit close to it too, it didn't seem that way at first. It seemed more like Torchic than Togepi. But the writers made
    it as popular as it is, like Oshawott




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    Quote Originally Posted by Doryuzu View Post
    The ratings for BW are perfectly fine, the show's ratings have been on a steady decline since it began back in OS, no succeeding saga's ratings have been better than the one before it.
    I think there's more to it than just that. I mean just from memory I remember seeing that list of ratings and almost as soon as I skimmed through the BW section I saw how much lower they were than the ones from DP, and I'm talking about a steep decline, not just that the ratings were low because the anime has been losing viewers since its peak in OS. I remember pointing out that the Tepig evolution episode had the lowest ratings that the anime has ever received (2.2 I think, but I can't be sure). Sure, people pointed out that the episode aired during Golden Week, but even for a GW episode, the ratings were still really bad. And I remember looking at the ratings for the episodes before and after it, and they were also pretty low. My point is that while the anime has obviously lost steam over the last decade, the ratings for BW have still been below average.

    Also, I don't buy the "ratings have been declining because people watch less television" thing. I think for kids it's much easier to just watch the anime on television than say, going online and watching it there. And as people keep pointing out, kids are the main audience. So I really think the ratings have been falling for other reasons.

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    Quote Originally Posted by TheFonz View Post
    Although I do see a bit of a difference in how they market certain Pokémon now. The way Piplup and Oshawott get shoved in our faces. I can't think of any Pokémon like that before DP. One could argue Psyduck, but even then it's in a different league than those two. Maybe Togepi, but it didn't have as much focus

    Although Axew is a bit close to it too, it didn't seem that way at first. It seemed more like Torchic than Togepi. But the writers made
    it as popular as it is, like Oshawott
    Pikachu says hi. Maybe Eevee.

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    Quote Originally Posted by OceanicLanturn View Post
    Pikachu says hi. Maybe Eevee.
    Ash's Pikachu. The first Pokémon of the mainest of the main characters. The Pokémon franchise's mascot. That's very different

    Ciccone, it's obvious that less people watch tv. Kids have a whole bunch of different gadgets than what they used to. They and even older people find themselves engrossed in those instead of flipping through channels. That's how it is now

    Another point. Back when Pokémon was on Kids' WB, they'd show an hour of each Pokémon and Yu-Gi-Oh! a day. Now Pokémon only airs in the morning for half an hour and it has a FREE iOS app with the possibility to watch every episode(when they're available). That is how different it is now. A lot of people don't even care about premieres...they'll see the rerun or watch on Netflix/Amazon/Hulu
    Last edited by TheFonz; 2nd March 2013 at 6:02 AM.




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    Quote Originally Posted by TheFonz View Post
    Ash's Pikachu. The first Pokémon of the mainest of the main characters. The Pokémon franchise's mascot. That's very different

    Ciccone, it's obvious that less people watch tv. Kids have a whole bunch of different gadgets than what they used to. They and even older people find themselves engrossed in those instead of flipping through channels. That's how it is now
    It's different because Pikachus a first, but they still marketed it the same way as Osha and Penguin. Theres always a clear cut on which poke is a money magnet, and which isn't. Piplup is a money magnet. Remember, the target aren't Foreign Teenagers/Adults, rather Japanese kids. So something you hate might be loved by the Japanese kids to death. Therefore, it's an 'all-clear' signal for writers to spam Piplup.

    Osha should've gone to Iris or Cilan so Ash can actually give sme other mon SCREENTIME.

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    Quote Originally Posted by OceanicLanturn View Post
    It's different because Pikachus a first, but they still marketed it the same way as Osha and Penguin. Theres always a clear cut on which poke is a money magnet, and which isn't. Piplup is a money magnet. Remember, the target aren't Foreign Teenagers/Adults, rather Japanese kids. So something you hate might be loved by the Japanese kids to death. Therefore, it's an 'all-clear' signal for writers to spam Piplup.

    Osha should've gone to Iris or Cilan so Ash can actually give sme other mon SCREENTIME.
    That was my point. It was always Pikachu. Other Pokémon were memorable and popular without the need of being shoved in our faces like Piplup and Oshawott. They were also developed better. Like in AG...there was nothing and it was still popular




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    Quote Originally Posted by Ciccone View Post
    I think there's more to it than just that. I mean just from memory I remember seeing that list of ratings and almost as soon as I skimmed through the BW section I saw how much lower they were than the ones from DP, and I'm talking about a steep decline, not just that the ratings were low because the anime has been losing viewers since its peak in OS. I remember pointing out that the Tepig evolution episode had the lowest ratings that the anime has ever received (2.2 I think, but I can't be sure). Sure, people pointed out that the episode aired during Golden Week, but even for a GW episode, the ratings were still really bad. And I remember looking at the ratings for the episodes before and after it, and they were also pretty low. My point is that while the anime has obviously lost steam over the last decade, the ratings for BW have still been below average.

    Also, I don't buy the "ratings have been declining because people watch less television" thing. I think for kids it's much easier to just watch the anime on television than say, going online and watching it there. And as people keep pointing out, kids are the main audience. So I really think the ratings have been falling for other reasons.
    GW episodes usually do poorly.

    Yes, as you pointed out kids are the one's that are taken into account for ratings and they wouldn't stop watching the show because Dawn left or Trip was an uninteresting rival. Regarding your other thoughts about not buying the notion less people are watching actual TV I pretty much pointed everything previously out with facts and I'm not sure what more to say other than that's the truth, in fact 50% of Japan's population today doesn't even have cable. The show, like almost all Japanese television, is losing steam over time. That doesn't mean it's doing poorly because the merchandise is the main mission in life for Pokemon anyway. Also, regarding BW having lower ratings than DP. DP had lower ratings than AG. AG had lower ratings than OS. See how this works? A future saga is never gonna one-up a previous one in the ratings game department. Things like that just can't be helped.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Doryuzu View Post
    GW episodes usually do poorly.

    Yes, as you pointed out kids are the one's that are taken into account for ratings and they wouldn't stop watching the show because Dawn left or Trip was an uninteresting rival. Regarding your other thoughts about not buying the notion less people are watching actual TV I pretty much pointed everything previously out with facts and I'm not sure what more to say other than that's the truth, in fact 50% of Japan's population today doesn't even have cable. The show, like almost all Japanese television, is losing steam over time. That doesn't mean it's doing poorly because the merchandise is the main mission in life for Pokemon anyway. Also, regarding BW having lower ratings than DP. DP had lower ratings than AG. AG had lower ratings than OS. See how this works? A future saga is never gonna one-up a previous one in the ratings game department. Things like that just can't be helped.
    Didn't AG do better than Johto or am I remembering that wrong? Maybe I'm just thinking of America




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    Quote Originally Posted by TheFonz View Post
    Didn't AG do better than Johto or am I remembering that wrong? Maybe I'm just thinking of America
    AG had lesser ratings in both America and Japan than Johto.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Doryuzu View Post
    AG had lesser ratings in both America and Japan than Johto.
    That's really interesting. I guess a lot of people went to Yu-Gi-Oh instead of Pokémon(well in America)




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    Quote Originally Posted by TheFonz View Post
    Ciccone, it's obvious that less people watch tv. Kids have a whole bunch of different gadgets than what they used to. They and even older people find themselves engrossed in those instead of flipping through channels. That's how it is now
    So you're using this [groundless] notion that the majority of people have stopped watching television to defend the increasing use of gimmicks in the anime? It seems like you're at least agreeing with those of us who say that the BW saga has been utilizing gimmick after gimmick for the sake of ratings, unless I'm missing something.

    But I just can't at some of the excuses that are being presented to defend the ratings issue. I mean what will people do when the ratings drop below 2.0? Continue blaming the anime's longevity? At some point the studio/network will have to make the decision to either cancel the anime or to continue using gimmicks, and if it's the latter then I pray for the future of the anime because as it stands I cannot tolerate all the self-indulgent promotion and advertising that the anime is being subjected to. It went from being a show with an actual story line and minimal merchandise promotion to being almost completely about products and little else. Imo, it's really sad how the anime has changed.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ciccone View Post
    So you're using this [groundless] notion that the majority of people have stopped watching television to defend the increasing use of gimmicks in the anime? It seems like you're at least agreeing with those of us who say that the BW saga has been utilizing gimmick after gimmick for the sake of ratings, unless I'm missing something.

    But I just can't at some of the excuses that are being presented to defend the ratings issue. I mean what will people do when the ratings drop below 2.0? Continue blaming the anime's longevity? At some point the studio/network will have to make the decision to either cancel the anime or to continue using gimmicks, and if it's the latter then I pray for the future of the anime because as it stands I cannot tolerate all the self-indulgent promotion and advertising that the anime is being subjected to. It went from being a show with an actual story line and minimal merchandise promotion to being almost completely about products and little else. Imo, it's really sad how the anime has changed.
    It's not groundless. It's based on personal experience and I'm sure many others can back up my claims. I also gave an example, the pennies/nickel/dimes thing. Also, Blockbuster is another great example. Just a few short years ago, EVERYONE went to Blockbuster to rent movies and even games. Now everyone has Netflix/On Demand/Youtube/Amazon/Hulu to watch things on and Blockbuster is pretty much out of business.

    And what are a lot of those programs watched on? Smartphones, Tablets, Computers, and videogame systems




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    Well, that dissolved quickly. By page 4 you guys weren't even trying to stay on topic, not to mention the obvious baiting some of you were doing. I'm pretty ticked that people are laughing at people who are excited for the flashback, however long and insignificant it might be in the long run. How about stop being a bully? Well, you're getting an infraction for it, so maybe you'll cut the crap.

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