Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast
Results 1 to 25 of 52

Thread: Is Ash Ketchum a Gary-Stu character?

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Oct 2012
    Posts
    242

    Default Is Ash Ketchum a Gary-Stu character?

    I'm not trying to complain here, but I find him to be a Gary-Stu. Reasons:

    -He has a lot of girls falling over him (both human and Pokemon)
    -He's been the chosen one multiple times.
    -He's befriended many legendary Pokemon, while others are lucky to even see one.
    -He has no real notable flaws, only minor ones, but they really don't affect him. He's impulsive and brash, which, in this anime, is synonymous for "brave and filled with willpower".
    -He "loves Pokemon more than anyone else". They fail to actually show it, but they sure tell us a lot.

    In conclusion, I think he's a Stu. Maybe not as bad as some other anime characters, but still one by Pokemon standards.
    Ghirajinxaphobia (or Ghirajinxphobia) - Fear of Ghirahim being cosplayed by a Jynx

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    my secret lair
    Posts
    2,554

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Brownie View Post
    I'm not trying to complain here, but I find him to be a Gary-Stu. Reasons:

    -He has a lot of girls falling over him (both human and Pokemon)
    -He's been the chosen one multiple times.
    -He's befriended many legendary Pokemon, while others are lucky to even see one.
    -He has no real notable flaws, only minor ones, but they really don't affect him. He's impulsive and brash, which, in this anime, is synonymous for "brave and filled with willpower".
    -He "loves Pokemon more than anyone else". They fail to actually show it, but they sure tell us a lot.

    In conclusion, I think he's a Stu. Maybe not as bad as some other anime characters, but still one by Pokemon standards.
    he has girls falling for him yet he dosn't realise and dosn't understand love.And like you say many of the female are pokemon which is hardly ideal
    he has been the chosen 1 but thats simply because he is the main character who else could be the chosen 1?
    he's befreinded many legnedaries but thats because he normally does something to earn their trust
    no notable flaws? he's gluttanous,at times incredibly stupid,rash,at times can be mean, single minded,emotional.
    he loves pokemon more than anyone else thats simply because he knows how to relate to them there are other people in the anime who are closer to their pokemon then ash.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    Kalos
    Posts
    4,740

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Brownie View Post
    I'm not trying to complain here, but I find him to be a Gary-Stu. Reasons:

    -He has a lot of girls falling over him (both human and Pokemon)
    -He's been the chosen one multiple times.
    -He's befriended many legendary Pokemon, while others are lucky to even see one.
    -He has no real notable flaws, only minor ones, but they really don't affect him. He's impulsive and brash, which, in this anime, is synonymous for "brave and filled with willpower".
    -He "loves Pokemon more than anyone else". They fail to actually show it, but they sure tell us a lot.

    In conclusion, I think he's a Stu. Maybe not as bad as some other anime characters, but still one by Pokemon standards.
    None of that has exactly any impact on a character being a Sue/Stu or not. It's just a term people seem to throw around without using correctly, it's starting to become a term without meaning because everyone and their mother uses it as an insult than anything else.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Oct 2012
    Posts
    242

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Doryuzu View Post
    None of that has exactly any impact on a character being a Sue/Stu or not. It's just a term people seem to throw around without using correctly, it's starting to become a term without meaning because everyone and their mother uses it as an insult than anything else.
    I'm not trying to insult him.

    Quote Originally Posted by Luthor View Post
    he loves pokemon more than anyone else thats simply because he knows how to relate to them there are other people in the anime who are closer to their pokemon then ash.
    True, but they keep beating it into our heads.
    Ghirajinxaphobia (or Ghirajinxphobia) - Fear of Ghirahim being cosplayed by a Jynx

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    Kalos
    Posts
    4,740

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Brownie View Post
    I'm not trying to insult him.
    I know, but Gary-Stu/Mary-Sue is pretty much a term without meaning these days when used by most. Even then zero of those traits are indicators of Ash's character being anything close to a Gary-Stu.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Forest
    Posts
    1,162

    Default

    To an extent I agree.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Posts
    550

    Default

    Idk about Mary-Sue but he certainly is not a good character. Alone, each trait is no problem, but when combined together, well, I can see why someone would think he's a Sue. Also, you forgot to add this in:

    *He has the powers of Aura. If not a trait, then at least cliched.
    I, stickerstaryoshi, am now authorized to use the usertitle "We got 3D: XY!", created by user Cresselia92 and to modify it according to my desires.

    Fan of the Mario and Luigi series since 2005.

  8. #8

    Default

    Oh boy. This topic made me remember the one about Iris.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Oct 2012
    Posts
    242

    Default

    I don't find Iris to be one. Here are the other people I think are Sues/Stus: Solidad, Paul, Tobiass
    Ghirajinxaphobia (or Ghirajinxphobia) - Fear of Ghirahim being cosplayed by a Jynx

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    Snowfield
    Posts
    6,173

    Default

    No I don't think he's one. More of a typical Shonen hero if you ask me.

    Cynthia's kind of a Sue, but she always gives me the vibe that she worked hard to be the awesome person she is so I let it go. XD

    And yeah sues/stus are used as an insult. It's like UGH THAT TAMAKI HE'S SUCH A STU. And it really works up the fans "HE'S NOT A STU!!!" Because Stu is like the lowest insult there is, fandom wise. XD

    But I have seen shows with Stus before though. There was this terrible one my mom watched with this girl who like kept messing things up and her boyfriend was like perfect looking and was always "It's ok I'm here for you blah blah" he had like no other personality, he was just so so bland. You have no idea how much that guy annoyed me. ._. THAT's what I'd call a Stu. I don't really consider anyone in this anime a Stu because it's just not complex enough to make Stus standout from not Stus. (Though I do like that Best Wishes has brought agonistic behaviors to Iris and Dento. Iris had that whole revenge episode, and Dento has cocky/villainous smiles without being the rival or reprimanded for their behavior. It fleshes them out)
    Last edited by JennaJayfeather; 3rd April 2013 at 5:05 PM.


    “...This is a tricky problem, huh. I really, really want to see the other Heroes... and if it works out, I want to make friends with them! If I made friends with six Heroes, I’d be an awesome mage! We could even conquer the world!”
    -Flatt Escardos, Fate Strange Fake
    3DS Friend Code: 1306-5187-6204
    tumblr|fanfiction

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Posts
    4,090

    Default

    Gary Stu/Mary Sues tend to be overly perfect character who has the story go their way due to favoritism with the writer or wish fulfillment. And I doubt anyone wishes to be Ash.

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Oct 2012
    Posts
    242

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by matt0044 View Post
    Gary Stu/Mary Sues tend to be overly perfect character who has the story go their way due to favoritism with the writer or wish fulfillment. And I doubt anyone wishes to be Ash.
    This is kind of the case with him, though. Maybe not to the extent of say, Paul, or Tobiass, but this still kind of describes him.
    Ghirajinxaphobia (or Ghirajinxphobia) - Fear of Ghirahim being cosplayed by a Jynx

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    Maryland
    Posts
    2,046

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by matt0044 View Post
    Gary Stu/Mary Sues tend to be overly perfect character who has the story go their way due to favoritism with the writer or wish fulfillment. And I doubt anyone wishes to be Ash.
    By that definition, Ash is nowhere near a Gary Stu.

    * Ash has lost 5 out of 7 Leagues he's participated in (Battle Frontier and Orange Islands)
    * Ash has lost to all his rivals more times than he's won (Besides Barry)
    * Ash has 3 stalkers that ruin almost everything special to him but expect him to save them when they're in danger
    * Ash reaches the wrong place at the wrong time commonly, and whenever he does, he's forced into a conflict between Legendary Pokemon, dying twice in the process.
    * During his first journey, he only actually beat a Gym Leader twice, the six other times, the Gym Leaders literally gave him the badge; Only beating TR, who weren't GL to begin with, and an old man stuck in a volcano.
    * A Legendary Pokemon actually fell in love with him, but he still wasn't able to keep her
    * Whenever Ash has a journey, he always ends up meeting an evil organization that end up almost killing him and taking control/severly hurting his Pokemon
    * After winning the Battle Frontier, Ash fought his rival with his strongest Pokemon, and still lost even though the Pokemon his rival was using was a new capture
    * Ash lost four times to the same Frontier Brain
    * The three times Ash actually had a chance at winning the Pokemon League, he lost to a Meowth, a Pokemon he had never heard of, and a trainer who spammed Legendaries
    * Because of his curse of a good will, Ash had to be separated from a bunch of his favorite Pokemon (Primeape, Squirtle, Charizard, Butterfree, Pidgeot, Larvitar, Gliscor, and Aipom) and one of which, was traded over to a girl who gave it so it could be a "Ping-Pong Champion"....

    I could say more but I'm pretty sure I'v gotten my point across.

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    Finland
    Posts
    1,615

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Brownie View Post
    This is kind of the case with him, though. Maybe not to the extent of say, Paul, or Tobiass, but this still kind of describes him.
    Not really, if the story went Ash's way he'd have won some leagues by now and wouldn't lose to beginners.

    I'd say Ash is realistically imperfect rather(other than his first two losses against Trip). Realistically you wouldn't probably win a league even after trying 5 times. Sure he gets to meet all the legendaries and stuff but of course the main character would.
    Last edited by Rohanator; 3rd April 2013 at 7:01 PM.
    XY group / Amourshipping Christmas fan comic: http://rohanite.tumblr.com/post/1061...-were-a-bit-of

    My art: http://rohanite.deviantart.com/gallery/

    This is Turtwig, he was the most under appreciated starter in Diamond & Pearl. If you picked Turtwig as your starter, put this in your sig. Started by Dax-360

  15. #15
    Join Date
    May 2012
    Location
    United States
    Posts
    469

    Default

    I don' think Ash is a stu either. Someone said it earlier, but he's realistically imperfect. Beyond just being brash and oblivious, there are several times when he's very rude or close-minded. Really, I think he's just the typical shonen hero. Does he run into a lot of Legendaeries? Yes, but that's a side effect of being the main character, not a Gary Stu.
    New Fanfic: The Ash Connection
    Weekly updates every Saturday

  16. #16
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    Canada
    Posts
    4,090

    Default

    No. I think the writers try really hard to make him a flawed Pokemon trainer, especially during League time. If he was a Gary Stu he'd evolve all of his Pokemon to legendary fourth stages, he would be able to control ubers, and the plot would revolve around him (Ash is the main character, but the plot is about the people he runs into as he travels - the same story could take place with anyone as the MC).

  17. #17
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Posts
    4,090

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Brownie View Post
    This is kind of the case with him, though. Maybe not to the extent of say, Paul, or Tobiass, but this still kind of describes him.
    Though even then, I'd refrain from the Stu accusation given his many loses.

  18. #18

    Default

    Try watching BW series and ask again after, hes far from being a Gary-StueXD Type. If any one, ask about Iris.
    A close family member of mine died today, I put this in my sign as respect for him

    Ash fan. Luffy fan. Gintoki fan-Gintama. Endou fan-Inazuma Eleven.
    Multi Luffy {One Piece} and Ash {Pokemon} Shippers.

  19. #19
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Posts
    4,090

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by BlueDragonfangirl View Post
    If any one, ask about Iris.
    Nah, I just find her to be annoying in a non-Mary Sueish way.

  20. #20

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by matt0044 View Post
    Nah, I just find her to be annoying in a non-Mary Sueish way.
    Tell me, what do you consider a Mary-Sue if you think Ash is a Gary-Stu? To me, Iris has all the signs of one but again thats me ^
    A close family member of mine died today, I put this in my sign as respect for him

    Ash fan. Luffy fan. Gintoki fan-Gintama. Endou fan-Inazuma Eleven.
    Multi Luffy {One Piece} and Ash {Pokemon} Shippers.

  21. #21
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Location
    Italy, the Green Boot
    Posts
    4,199

    Default

    I don't consider Iris a Mary Sue. Sure, in my opinion some wins seemed a bit cheap, but other than that she has lost many times. Maybe, but just maybe, she appeared too... knowledgeable at the beginning, but after a while her knowledge made somewhat sense (even if I still fail to understand where she got all her knowledge, if during her schooltime she wasn't shown very capable...).

    Back to the topic, no. Ash can't be defined a Gary Stu. He has many flaws and the fateful encounters are simply connected to the fact that he's the main character.
    MY MAIN FANFICS


    Super Smash Bros Clash: 6 chapters, ongoing | Pokémon Best Wishes Reloaded: 3 episodes, ongoing

    Check out my little sprite gallery by clicking here!

  22. #22
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Posts
    550

    Default

    The title should be changed to "Is Ash Ketchum a poorly-written character?"
    I, stickerstaryoshi, am now authorized to use the usertitle "We got 3D: XY!", created by user Cresselia92 and to modify it according to my desires.

    Fan of the Mario and Luigi series since 2005.

  23. #23

    Default

    The only characters I think is a Sue is Tobias, and that's only because he didn't get enough screentime to flesh him out enough.

    -He has a lot of girls falling over him (both human and Pokemon)
    A lot of characters have been the object of desire for some other characters.

    -He's been the chosen one multiple times.
    Maybe in the first and second movie, and a few other times. Those were instances of lazy writing and the writers grew out of that.

    -He's befriended many legendary Pokemon, while others are lucky to even see one.
    Ash and co star in movies, legendaries star in movies. Of course they'd meet. Besides, they usually meet legendaries by chance. May befriended Manaphy and Max befriended Jirachi. That's because Ash and his friends are the protagonists. They regularly meet legendaries, but that's not a sign of being a Gary Stu.

    -He has no real notable flaws, only minor ones, but they really don't affect him. He's impulsive and brash, which, in this anime, is synonymous for "brave and filled with willpower".
    His brash reckless attitude lead him to get severely poisoned in the Venipede nature. His blind acceptance of Meowth lead him and his friends into getting their Pokemon stolen.

    He was an extremely immature, impatient, thick-headed kid at the start of his journey, and over time and through the course of much character development, became a more mature and level-headed person. He often still loses in matches and makes bone-headed mistakes because he still has quite a bit to learn in battle. And while he is sweet and nice, he's still somewhat oblivious to real world problems. That's why he still needs the maturity of Brock and Cilan.

    -He "loves Pokemon more than anyone else". They fail to actually show it, but they sure tell us a lot.
    He nearly died saving a Sewaddle from going over a waterfall. (he was saved by Burgh because he didn't think the rescue through.) He was told by Burgh not to pull out that Venipede from the hole because it would poison him (and it did.) Even if he might not love Pokemon more than anyone else, it's clear that he deeply cares for them, and has, time and again, done anything he could to help Pokemon in danger. He's proven that he has a big heart, even if it does get him into trouble.

    I honestly don't believe a character is a Mary Sue just because they have positive traits. He's not the best-written character, but he's dynamic enough to function.

  24. #24

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by marioluigifan05 View Post
    The title should be changed to "Is Ash Ketchum a poorly-written character?"
    you mine as well ask, is Pokemon a poorly written show thanXD
    A close family member of mine died today, I put this in my sign as respect for him

    Ash fan. Luffy fan. Gintoki fan-Gintama. Endou fan-Inazuma Eleven.
    Multi Luffy {One Piece} and Ash {Pokemon} Shippers.

  25. #25
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Posts
    213

    Default

    Gary-Stu characters don't lose to rookies

Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •