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Thread: Serebii CCAT2

  1. #276
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eaglehawk View Post
    Okay. Maybe it's a bit too early too start throwing it out there, but I've tried the CBTar and CBScizor iteration of the team, and so far it's doing well (16-5). However, I find that this team doesn't handle Sub + DD Gyarados very well, despite having Rotom-W and a crapton of Rock coverage. I don't know whether or not it's just that i was playing too carelessly or not, but it's definitely something I find bothersome. Also, on a side note, every time I try to Revenge Sub + DD Gyarados without the Sub, Stone Edge tends to fail and cause a sweep.
    I ran Quick Attack on Scizor. 2HKOs bulky Gyarados after Stealth Rocks with sandstorm. Rotom W and good usage of Landorus-T's intimidate helps further. Gyarados also doesn't set up on anything really besides -2 Latias and Band TTar locked into Pursuit (and if Gyarados is such an issue you should be wary using those moves anyway).

  2. #277

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    Okay, so I tested the team on a few alts seeing how far I could get on a win streak (I'm using the version with CB Scizor blah blah). So far my record for win streaks is 17, and the other 3 or 4 weren't far behind. I have to say, the team is actually doing quite well. However, Landorus-T really seems to be the weak link. I've gotten maybe 2 or 3 decent sweeps out of it, and it has never really swept easily late game like I thought it would. Most of the time, I don't even set up since an Adamant LO-boosted Earthquake is pretty legit on its own. I've been considering running U-turn somewhere due to the raw usefulness of netting free momentum, and perhaps HP Ice to murder Garchomp, Salamence (without relying on Stone Edge), Landorus-I/T, Gliscor, etc. I've also thought about adjusting the EVs if I were to change up the set, possibly to a 80 HP / 252 Atk / 176 Spe spread. This would give Landorus-T enough speed to beat Adamant Gyarados while also boosting its Atk. 80 HP also hits 339, a Life Orb number, which is nice.

    Of course, changing Landorus-T's set like that would essentially kill the main win condition of the team and ruin the purpose of the CCAT, but like I said earlier, I just throw out attacks most of the time anyways. I just never find many chances to sweep with this thing.

  3. #278
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    Quote Originally Posted by jesusfreak94 View Post
    Okay, so I tested the team on a few alts seeing how far I could get on a win streak (I'm using the version with CB Scizor blah blah). So far my record for win streaks is 17, and the other 3 or 4 weren't far behind. I have to say, the team is actually doing quite well. However, Landorus-T really seems to be the weak link. I've gotten maybe 2 or 3 decent sweeps out of it, and it has never really swept easily late game like I thought it would. Most of the time, I don't even set up since an Adamant LO-boosted Earthquake is pretty legit on its own. I've been considering running U-turn somewhere due to the raw usefulness of netting free momentum, and perhaps HP Ice to murder Garchomp, Salamence (without relying on Stone Edge), Landorus-I/T, Gliscor, etc. I've also thought about adjusting the EVs if I were to change up the set, possibly to a 80 HP / 252 Atk / 176 Spe spread. This would give Landorus-T enough speed to beat Adamant Gyarados while also boosting its Atk. 80 HP also hits 339, a Life Orb number, which is nice.

    Of course, changing Landorus-T's set like that would essentially kill the main win condition of the team and ruin the purpose of the CCAT, but like I said earlier, I just throw out attacks most of the time anyways. I just never find many chances to sweep with this thing.
    100% this. In testing I literally never used Swords Dance, and only Rock Polished possibly once every four battles. Just slamming Life Orb hits has been far more effective. Rock Polish / EQ / Stone Edge / HP Ice or U-turn would be far more effective.

  4. #279
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    I agree. We definitely need a more dynamic build for Landorus-T. Granted that it does deviate from our original win condition (Double Dance ftw), our team doesn't really fit the "protect the carry" build, which is, most of the time, necessary if you want to run anything Double Dance. Furthermore, Landorus-T's actual team potential is greatly diminished with a pure offensive set (not too sure now with Lando-I banned).

    Speaking of bans, I think that the need for LO Latias has passed. From my perspective of looking at this team head on, Latias is pretty much only there to effectively serve as a check against Landorus-I (specifically Lando + Keldy abuse). Considering one of the pivotal pieces to that core is gone now, Latias seems less optimal in my opinion and needs to be replaced with something stronger while serving the same role on the team. It's probably way too early to start calling changes right now, but I think Life Orb Latios would serve this team well with the shift in this metagame. One thing I always found marginally frustrating is how Latias doesn't deal as much damage as I initially envisioned, especially with the butchered 72 HP / 184 SpA / 252+ Spe EVs, but she had to stay due to her ability to better check Lando-I (specifically survive a 2HKO from HP Ice). With that gone, I think going for a more pure damage build is better suited for this team.

    Latios @ Life Orb
    Trait: Levitate
    Nature: Timid (+Spe, -Att)
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
    - Draco Meteor
    - Psyshock
    - Roost
    - Hidden Power Fire

    As you can see, I have made no changes to the moveset simply because it gives this team the most optimal amount of offense and team support.

    EDIT: Also, I did a mock-up of Jesus' set

    Landorus-T @ Life Orb
    Trait: Intimidate
    Nature: Adamant (+Att, - SpA)
    EVs: 80 HP / 252 Att / 176 Spe
    - Earthquake
    - Stone Edge
    - Rock Polish
    - HP Ice

    Here's some calcs regarding an HP Ice coming off of Lando

    0SpAtk Life Orb Landorus Therian (-SAtk) Hidden Power (Ice) vs 252HP/0SpDef Gliscor (Neutral): 88% - 103% (312 - 368 HP). Guaranteed 2HKO. 25% chance to OHKO.
    0SpAtk Life Orb Landorus Therian (-SAtk) Hidden Power (Ice) vs 200HP/0SpDef Landorus Therian (Neutral): 80% - 95% (296 - 352 HP). Guaranteed 2HKO.
    0SpAtk Life Orb Landorus Therian (-SAtk) Hidden Power (Ice) vs 4HP/0SpDef Garchomp (Neutral): 79% - 93% (284 - 336 HP). Guaranteed 2HKO.
    0SpAtk Life Orb Landorus Therian (-SAtk) Hidden Power (Ice) vs 4HP/0SpDef Salamence (Neutral): 89% - 106% (296 - 352 HP). Guaranteed 2HKO. 35% chance to OHKO.
    0SpAtk Life Orb Landorus Therian (-SAtk) Hidden Power (Ice) vs 4HP/0SpDef Salamence (-SpDef): 97% - 116% (324 - 388 HP). Guaranteed 2HKO. 87% chance to OHKO.
    Last edited by Eaglehawk; 16th July 2013 at 2:10 AM.
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  5. #280

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    That set works. I think you'd be fine running a Naughty nature, though. Landorus-T isn't exactly the type to stay in and try to take many special attacks to begin with, and having a neutral nature for HP Ice could be useful. For example, you are now almost guaranteed to OHKO 252/0 Gliscor (moving just 4 EVs from HP to SpA guarantees it). HP Ice against 200/0 Landorus-T is now a guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock. 4/0 Garchomp goes from a 6.25% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock to a 62.5% chance (lol). 4/0 Salamence is almost always OHKO'd from full health (again, 4 SpA EVs clinches it). Of course, there might be a couple of special attacks that we might need that neutral nature to survive, but if that's not the case, I'd opt for Naughty > Adamant. You could also go for those extra 4 SpA EVs, but with Stealth Rock taken into account (as well as Sandstorm in the case of Salamence), it's probably not going to be often that those two troublemakers actually come in with full health.

  6. #281
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    I agree with all that's been said, the team would greatly benefit if landorus-t got hp ice considering we don't have too much ice coverage to begin with. Instead of rock polish though, I think we should run Substitute. Landorus-T forces so many switches, it can easily get up a sub once the opposing pokemon switches out. It allows us to (1.) scout, (2.) take an ice shard and get off heavy damage on mamoswine, and (3.) weaken opposing mons. There's actually a set on smogon for this too, which I think fits our team. Without swords dance in conjunction with rock polish, landorus-t isn't going to sweep anyway. With sub, it can support the team more by wearing down the other team and scouting for scarfs.

    Landorus-T (M) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Intimidate
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spd
    Naive Nature (+Spd, -SDef)
    - Substitute
    - Earthquake
    - Stone Edge
    - Hidden Power [Ice]

    On the other hand, another option would be to take out land-t completely and replace it with the almighty sandslash, which i implied in a previous post.
    Having a spinner would definitely help because our team doesn't really appreciate hazards. Also sand rush = free rock polish so all it needs is an SD and it can sweep. It can even run x-scissor to take out celebi (69% chance to ohko defensive variant with a life orb), which I can see our team having problems with if it's carrying baton pass. I've actually tested it in place of lando-t and it's pretty useful; the only problem is it's pretty frail by OU standards so it won't be getting too many chances to spin if you play it too recklessly, especially with life orb damage.

    Latias is fine in my opinion. It stilll hits hard with a life orb and we need its extra bulk over latios to tank hits from sun teams and rain teams.

    -Edit- Ferrothorn and forretress are hard to handle with this team. Stall in general is just a ***** to face when using this team... any suggestions? I was thinking maybe put Fire Punch on t-tar over ice punch. What do you guys think?
    Last edited by Rising Star; 19th July 2013 at 3:16 AM.

  7. #282
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rising Star View Post
    I agree with all that's been said, the team would greatly benefit if landorus-t got hp ice considering we don't have too much ice coverage to begin with. Instead of rock polish though, I think we should run Substitute. Landorus-T forces so many switches, it can easily get up a sub once the opposing pokemon switches out. It allows us to (1.) scout, (2.) take an ice shard and get off heavy damage on mamoswine, and (3.) weaken opposing mons. There's actually a set on smogon for this too, which I think fits our team. Without swords dance in conjunction with rock polish, landorus-t isn't going to sweep anyway. With sub, it can support the team more by wearing down the other team and scouting for scarfs.

    Landorus-T (M) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Intimidate
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spd
    Naive Nature (+Spd, -SDef)
    - Substitute
    - Earthquake
    - Stone Edge
    - Hidden Power [Ice]
    Sub Landorus could work. I removed Swords Dance for HP Ice though and it seems to be good enough for the time being.

    On the other hand, another option would be to take out land-t completely and replace it with the almighty sandslash, which i implied in a previous post.
    Having a spinner would definitely help because our team doesn't really appreciate hazards. Also sand rush = free rock polish so all it needs is an SD and it can sweep. It can even run x-scissor to take out celebi (69% chance to ohko defensive variant with a life orb), which I can see our team having problems with if it's carrying baton pass. I've actually tested it in place of lando-t and it's pretty useful; the only problem is it's pretty frail by OU standards so it won't be getting too many chances to spin if you play it too recklessly, especially with life orb damage.
    How is this team weak to entry hazards? Half the team is immune to Spikes, 4/6 of the team is immune to Toxic Spikes, and nothing is weak to Stealth Rock.

    Sandslash is an OK Pokemon, but it isn't really all that fast under sand... Scarf Terrakion, Keldeo etc still outrun it and without sand it's virtually useless. It needs Life Orb to be any sort of threat at all, which counteracts Rapid Spin's utility a bit. It isn't bad but it also opens us up to fighting moves. Latias would be our only resist.

    -Edit- Ferrothorn and forretress are hard to handle with this team. Stall in general is just a ***** to face when using this team... any suggestions? I was thinking maybe put Fire Punch on t-tar over ice punch. What do you guys think?
    Yeah I ended up running Fire Punch too. With HP Ice on Landorus it generally removed other Landorus by itself. After a while I had some trouble with Terrakion and Heatran more so I just ran Superpower, but Fire Punch works too.

    I didn't have any trouble with stall though. Terrakion alone is able to cripple most physical walls, while Landorus is nearly unstoppable against defensive teams. Trick Rotom, Volt-turn combo, Band TTar etc. Just wear down one wall and you should be able to sweep.



    OK so I tried using this team a little more. Currently I'm at a 24-0 win / loss record (and counting). The only major problems I have had were defensive Heatran and SD Scizor, though neither were an auto-loss.


    Tyranitar @ Choice Band
    Trait: Sand Stream
    EVs: 152 HP / 252 Atk / 104 Spd
    Adamant Nature
    - Crunch
    - Stone Edge
    - Pursuit
    - Superpower

    104 Speed outruns pretty much all Skarmory, Jellicent, Scizor, and speed creeps other CB TTars. Superpower is a good spammable move to hit a lot of common switch ins like Heatran, Terrakion, Ferrothorn, and Breloom all at once. I had trouble with Heatran so I switched Fire Punch to Superpower, but haven't actually tested it.


    Landorus-Therian (M) @ Life Orb
    Trait: Intimidate
    EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Naughty Nature
    - Earthquake
    - Stone Edge
    - Hidden Power [Ice]
    - Rock Polish

    Running mixed makes Landorus slightly more useful than double dance, but Rock Polish is still virtually never used. We could run Superpower or even Gravity over Rock Polish. Or U-turn, but with Life Orb Landy's chances to attack are fairly limited, and I would rather blow holes in the opposing team than I would blow holes in myself for a light bug hit.


    Rotom-Wash @ Choice Scarf
    Trait: Levitate
    EVs: 232 HP / 56 SAtk / 220 Spd
    Modest Nature
    - Volt Switch
    - Hydro Pump
    - Hidden Power [Ice]
    - Trick

    HP Ice > all. No such thing as too many Dragonite checks.


    Terrakion @ Focus Sash
    Trait: Justified
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spd
    Jolly Nature
    - Close Combat
    - Stone Edge
    - Stealth Rock
    - Taunt

    I never tested Swords Dance but Taunt has worked out very well.


    Latias (F) @ Life Orb
    Trait: Levitate
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature
    - Draco Meteor
    - Psyshock
    - Recover
    - Hidden Power [Fire]

    I switched the EVs to max / max and haven't noticed a difference. Both spreads work fine.


    Scizor @ Choice Band
    Trait: Technician
    EVs: 252 Atk / 244 HP / 12 Spd
    Adamant Nature
    - Bullet Punch
    - U-turn
    - Superpower
    - Quick Attack

    Quick Attack has come in handy multiple times. Rotom W, Volcarona, Keldeo, Ninetales, Gyarados, Infernape, Jolteon, Thundurus, Politoed, Starmie etc. No one ever seems to expect it either. 12 speed outruns other Scizor, which I like so I can actually clip 25% off them with Bullet Punch even if I'm low on HP, or U-turn away without taking a hit.



    Edit:

    Hey what if we run CB Terrakion and change Landorus T to an HP Ice / EQ / U-turn / Stealth Rock set? It would let Landy T lure in Gliscor / other Landorus while getting rocks down. TTar would KO Lati@s and Celebi (unless Landy T does itself) meaning Band Terrakion can just walk over the opposing team.
    Last edited by Shiny Magmortar; 20th July 2013 at 2:40 AM.

  8. #283

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    Quote Originally Posted by Shiny Magmortar View Post
    Edit:

    Hey what if we run CB Terrakion and change Landorus T to an HP Ice / EQ / U-turn / Stealth Rock set? It would let Landy T lure in Gliscor / other Landorus while getting rocks down. TTar would KO Lati@s and Celebi (unless Landy T does itself) meaning Band Terrakion can just walk over the opposing team.
    That could work. I've tried a similar combination on Team Monkeyfish (and a couple other team drafts), and these are the sets I'd recommend.

    Landorus (Landorus-T) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Intimidate
    EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 Def
    Relaxed Nature
    -Earthquake
    -Hidden Power [Ice]
    -U-turn
    -Stealth Rock

    Terrakion @ Choice Band
    Trait: Justified
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spd
    Jolly Nature
    -Close Combat
    -Stone Edge
    -X-Scissor / Earthquake
    -Quick Attack

    I usually use Relaxed on defensive Landorus-T since I don't believe Impish really doesn't let you outspeed anything of note (I could be wrong, but I doubt it). You could use the offensive pivot set in the analysis with HP Ice > Stone Edge, but I'd recommend a slightly different EV spread (I'll explain it later if anyone wants to use a stronger set instead). We could also give Earthquake a try on Terrakion. The coverage is kinda redundant, but it really screws with several key Rain Pokemon like Tentacruel, Jirachi, and ESPECIALLY Toxicroak better than any of Terrakion's other moves. Besides, X-Scissor barely hits those Psychic types harder than Stone Edge besides Celebi, but I guess that can still be useful.
    Last edited by jesusfreak94; 20th July 2013 at 3:04 AM.

  9. #284
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rising Star View Post
    -Edit- Ferrothorn and forretress are hard to handle with this team. Stall in general is just a ***** to face when using this team... any suggestions? I was thinking maybe put Fire Punch on t-tar over ice punch. What do you guys think?
    After I switched Latias over to Latios, Ferrothorn and Forretress both have become a much lesser threat than before. Besides, the whole point as to why we have Trick Scarf Rotom-W is to shut down key members of a stall/defensive core so the other stallbreaker (Lati@s) can finish them off.

    Furthermore, I find your Substitute Lando-T to be extremely underwhelming and less fitting to the general structure of the offense team. Although Substitute s cool for dodging status (something this team doesn't handle very well), I find Rock Polish Lando-T more useful as the late-game sweeper. It also allows this team to one-up other offensive teams pretty easily.

    As for my team, I'm at a 14/1 win-lose ratio (that one loss was to a Durant + Dugtrio core -_____-)

    Landorus-Therian (M) @ Life Orb
    Trait: Intimidate
    EVs: 252 Atk / 176 Spd / 80 HP
    Adamant Nature
    - Hidden Power [Ice]
    - Rock Polish
    - Stone Edge
    - Earthquake

    Yeah. Biggest change right here so far. Basically I took (read: stole) Jesusfreak's set and tacked it on to this team. From that point on, he became the team's #1 switch into Dragonite/Salamence/Garchomp/Gliscor/other Landorus-T/Gligar (Yes. I did face a Gligar at around 1850). I was actually surprised that during my ladder climb with this team, I had a lot of opportunities to set up and sweep for a few turns (probably because of the new no-Landorus-I metagame).

    Rotom-Wash @ Choice Scarf
    Trait: Levitate
    Shiny: Yes
    EVs: 232 HP / 56 SAtk / 220 Spd
    Modest Nature
    - Hydro Pump
    - Volt Switch
    - Pain Split
    - Trick

    Same set as before. Magmortar makes a good point about adding HP-Ice to check Dragonite and unscarfed forms of 4x weak dragons. However, our team literally facerolls all over these, especially with an almost no-fail Stealth Rock from Terrakion.

    Terrakion @ Focus Sash
    Trait: Justified
    EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spd / 4 HP
    Jolly Nature
    - Close Combat
    - Stone Edge
    - Swords Dance
    - Stealth Rock

    Same set, different day. Swords Dance did come in pretty helpful in some cases, but like what Magmortar said, it offers less utility in stopping stuff like a Lead Ferrothorn/Forretress, who automatically gets some form of entry hazard up because CC 2HKOs both of them.

    Latios (M) @ Life Orb
    Trait: Levitate
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 Spd / 252 SAtk
    Timid Nature
    - Draco Meteor
    - Psyshock
    - Roost
    - Hidden Power [Fire]

    Biggest change right here. I actually got tired of using Latias completely. Even when I ran the 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe spread, her power was still underwhelming to some degree. We already have Rotom-W and Tyranitar to handler with Rain and Sun respectively, so justification for Latias went down. Furthermore, with the ban on Landorus-I, I find Latias to be even less efficient as an offensive pokemon. So instead, I switched over to Latios. The power output was noticeably different to the point where I could shred stall/defensive cores (not CeleTran though damn you) with these 3 moves alone.

    Tyranitar @ Choice Band
    Trait: Sand Stream
    EVs: 180 HP / 252 Atk / 76 Spd
    Adamant Nature
    - Pursuit
    - Stone Edge
    - Crunch
    - Superpower

    He's fine where he is. I personally think he should be more bulky since he's the one I use to take down Ninetales.

    Scizor @ Choice Band
    Trait: Technician
    EVs: 252 Atk / 248 HP / 8 SDef
    Adamant Nature
    - U-turn
    - Bullet Punch
    - Superpower
    - Pursuit

    Yeah I run double Pursuit. Theoretically, this should play mind games as to who's going to come in and Pursuit trap your Pokemon. Furthermore, both of the Pursuiters have insane power and decent bulk and check different pokemon, giving this team more lockdown potential easier sweeps.

    When I was playing with this team so far, I noticed that there were two things that were extremely problematic to this team.

    Celebi: Yeah. She's a b!tch. The combination of Leaf Storm and Hidden Power Fire guarantees that no one on the team except Latios can switch in to her (Latios is a weak switchin to Celebi in the first place). She can't be Pursuited due to the fact that she can OHKO or 2HKO both of the Pursuiters on this team (sadly).

    Alakazam: Just as problematic. Focus Sash 99% of the time guarantees him a kill, especially with hazards (Stealth Rock specifically) down on your side. The best answer I came up to him so far is Scizor. I switch-in, take a Focus Blast. Bullet Punch, take a Focus Blast. Then Bullet Punch again for the KO. However, this is really inefficient as it effectively knocks Scizor out of the game, especially with Stealth Rock down on your side of the field.

    CB Terrakion + Pivot Landorus-T sounds pretty neato, but I'm just slightly afraid of racking up Hazards damage on Terrakion. Furthermore, it makes the team slightly more Priority weak since we're centering the sweep around Terrakion now.
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  10. #285

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    Yeah, I've noticed the trouble with Alakazam on a recent ladder marathon myself. I'm using Mag's version with those two sets I posted above, and I had trouble breaking Alakazam's Focus Sash so that I got a chance to finish it off with Scizor. Overall, though, the team is pretty solid from what I've seen and played. I might test out a few things later, but I do think for now that it's a good idea to bump Rotom-W's speed up by 4 EVs. In one of my matches, I got into a situation where Rotom-W could have swept the opponent's team with Hydro Pump, but I lost the speed tie against a Jolteon. Jolteon is often seen on opposing Rain teams, and while the opponent's Rain is up, Rotom-W's Hydro Pump OHKOs Jolteon 43.75% of the time from full health. Even when Rain isn't up, Rotom-W does ~60% minimum to Jolteon, so it can still kill a weakened one. It's not a huge deal, but unless those 4 HP EVs are needed to survive a certain attack or something, it would be great to give Rotom-W just enough speed to destroy some weakened Rain teams without Jolteon getting in the way half the time.

  11. #286
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    Quote Originally Posted by CedOmega View Post
    I, too, vote Offensive . But I want to add, since everyone is concerned about Landorus-T's health, why not use the alternative Double Dance spread of 72 Hp/ 252 Attack/ 184 Speed? It's best used on a turn where Landorus-T is sure to force a switch and set up RP right away.
    Haha. I suggested a spread very similar to the one most of you are currently using now. Just a shame that noone listened to me then. XD

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  12. #287
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    Max Speed Landorus outruns Adamant Lucario and Timid Heatran. Is it worth losing the ability to beat both of those for just 20 more HP points?

  13. #288
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    So you're saying we should have THREE banded pokes on one team? I think what we have now is fine. Focus sash terrakion is fine as it is; in fact, it's probably an even bigger threat than banded because it forces the opponent to attack twice to ko and its speed allows us to get up stealth rock more reliably than landorus-t.

    Furthermore, I find your Substitute Lando-T to be extremely underwhelming and less fitting to the general structure of the offense team. Although Substitute s cool for dodging status (something this team doesn't handle very well), I find Rock Polish Lando-T more useful as the late-game sweeper. It also allows this team to one-up other offensive teams pretty easily.
    I hate to sound condescending, but you missed the point of sub entirely. Substitute is there so that we can scout out the opponent's sets and weaken their team without fear of getting ohkoed. By getting off damage as they break the sub, we can see if it's leftovers, life orb, choiced, etc. Also, most of the time the opponent will have to sack a pokemon in order to remove the sub. Intimidate alone is enough to force switches, so getting up a free substitute shouldn't be a problem (most people dont expect sub anyway). Besides, we already came to an agreement that landorus-t wont be our late game sweeper. It really can't "sweep" with just rock polish; most of the time its attack power falls just short of ohkoing bulky pokemon, even with life orb.

    How is this team weak to entry hazards? Half the team is immune to Spikes, 4/6 of the team is immune to Toxic Spikes, and nothing is weak to Stealth Rock.

    Sandslash is an OK Pokemon, but it isn't really all that fast under sand... Scarf Terrakion, Keldeo etc still outrun it and without sand it's virtually useless. It needs Life Orb to be any sort of threat at all, which counteracts Rapid Spin's utility a bit. It isn't bad but it also opens us up to fighting moves. Latias would be our only resist.
    Well, not really weak per say but with entry hazards up our scizor isnt going to be doing much u-turning. T-tar also doesn't really appreciate hazards as it's already pretty frail and will probably die to most physical attacks once its weakened by stealth rocks and spikes.

    I do agree, however, that we should stick with landy-t. I tested out sandslash and it's just too frail for my liking. It can't do much to ferrothorn without a boost, and even if it does get an SD it still can't ohko.

    Rotom-Wash @ Choice Scarf
    Trait: Levitate
    EVs: 232 HP / 56 SAtk / 220 Spd
    Modest Nature
    - Volt Switch
    - Hydro Pump
    - Hidden Power [Ice]
    - Trick

    HP Ice > all. No such thing as too many Dragonite checks.
    I run hp ice over pain split too. I rarely used pain split when I tested the team. What if your opponent predicts it and sends out a pokemon with lower health? Then you're screwed. I prefer hp ice to take out things like garchomp and dragonite.


    Rotom-W does ~60% minimum to Jolteon, so it can still kill a weakened one. It's not a huge deal, but unless those 4 HP EVs are needed to survive a certain attack or something, it would be great to give Rotom-W just enough speed to destroy some weakened Rain teams without Jolteon getting in the way half the time.
    I doubt the 4 hp EVs are relevant, just transfer them over to speed.

    -----

    I use latias over latios because the bulk is needed to take on rain teams. Latios gets 2hkoed by keldeo and jellicent while latias does not. The extra power isn't really that important in my opinion. I was also playing on PO during testing, where landorus still isnt banned yet so that's also part of the reason.

    Pursuit and quick attack are both good options. I went with quick attack personally but pursuit can be used too for jellicent, gengar, and the lati twins.

    Can't think of much else to say... I'll post more later when i get back.

    -Edit- In terms of laddering, I went something like 12-2 when I tested the team. The first loss was to a baton pass team and the second was to a sand team.

    Threats:
    -Scarf Salamence (if scizor is gone)
    -Bulky SD scizor (if it gets to +2 or greater)
    -Volcarona (if terrakion's sash is broken)

    ...will be updating threat list later.
    Last edited by Rising Star; 20th July 2013 at 6:10 PM.

  14. #289
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    Ok, I've adjusted the team in the OP due to the things being discussed on the thread that everyone has generally agreed on, those being:

    -CB Scizor
    -Transferring 4 HP EV's on Rotom-W to Speed
    -Hidden Power Ice on Rotom-W
    -Superpower and Fire Punch being options on Tyranitar

    Now it is time to make any edits on the team. We will be voting on which sets or members we would like to change. Here are the options.

    Bulky Pivot Landorus-T
    Mixed Rock Polish Landorus-T (252/252 stats)
    Double Dance Landorus-T
    Sub Landorus-T

    CB Terrakion
    Sash Terrakion

    Latios over Latias
    Keep Latias

    Please vote for one of each category.
    Last edited by Sparkbeat; 21st July 2013 at 9:38 PM.

    Trainer Level 3 Squad | Alpha Sapphire Team - - En Route from Petalburg to Slateport via Ocean | WF Quest Log

  15. #290

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    Can we add bulky pivot Landorus-T to the list? I like having CB Terrakion on the team, but doing so would require we move Stealth Rock somewhere else, and the best place seems to be on Landorus. I'll just hold off on that vote for now.

    I would like to vote to keep Latias, though.

  16. #291
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    Quote Originally Posted by jesusfreak94 View Post
    Can we add bulky pivot Landorus-T to the list? I like having CB Terrakion on the team, but doing so would require we move Stealth Rock somewhere else, and the best place seems to be on Landorus. I'll just hold off on that vote for now.
    Yes, added.

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  17. #292
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    Don't forget to add Sub Landorus-T. Good set, highly underrated. I already posted my reasoning as to why I think it should be run on this team.

  18. #293
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rising Star View Post
    Don't forget to add Sub Landorus-T. Good set, highly underrated. I already posted my reasoning as to why I think it should be run on this team.
    I think RP would be much more beneficial, but sure.

    Trainer Level 3 Squad | Alpha Sapphire Team - - En Route from Petalburg to Slateport via Ocean | WF Quest Log

  19. #294
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    Quote Originally Posted by Contrail View Post
    Ok, I've adjusted the team in the OP due to the things being discussed on the thread that everyone has generally agreed on, those being:

    -CB Scizor
    -Transferring 4 HP EV's on Rotom-W to Speed
    -Hidden Power Ice on Rotom-W
    -Superpower and Fire Punch being options on Tyranitar

    Now it is time to make any edits on the team. We will be voting on which sets or members we would like to change. Here are the options.

    Bulky Pivot Landorus-T
    Mixed Rock Polish Landorus-T (252/252 stats)
    Double Dance Landorus-T
    Sub Landorus-T

    CB Terrakion
    Sash Terrakion

    Latios over Latias
    Keep Latias

    Please vote for one of each category.
    Mixed Rock Polish Landorus
    Sash Terrakion
    Latias


    Though Bulky Pivot Landy and Band Terrakion work fine too, I just prefer having two sweepers. Mostly personal preference here. Both options work great.

    Latias > Latios because Latias is an offensive tank, not a sweeper. Its job is to switch in, take a hit, and force a switch, then do tremendous damage to whatever comes it or simply recover the damage off. Latios can do that too but with significantly less defenses. Also fun fact, Latias has overall much better stats than Latios. Assuming 252 / 252 spreads...

    Latios has 12.5% more Special Attack than Latias.
    Latias has 15.6% more Special Defense than Latios.
    Latias has 10.2% more Defense than Latios.

    In other words due to the way EVs and base stats work the only reason to use Latios at all is for the 12.5% more Special Attack, which honestly isn't needed as much as significantly more bulk. Latias is very important here to sponge water and grass hits. We need lasting power, not firepower.

  20. #295
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shiny Magmortar View Post
    Mixed Rock Polish Landorus
    Sash Terrakion
    Latias
    Voting this

    Trainer Level 3 Squad | Alpha Sapphire Team - - En Route from Petalburg to Slateport via Ocean | WF Quest Log

  21. #296
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    Mixed Substitute Landorus-T (with leftovers)
    Sash Terrakion
    Latias

    Still think you guys don't give sub lando-t enough credit. RP doesn't help when it still gets taken out by priority ice shard and 2hkoed by banded bullet punch. Sub has saved my *** so many times, especially against rain teams. Plus it usually forces them to sack their scarfer to take out the sub if they don't have bp or ice shard.

    But if you guys are going to go with RP, go with adamant + life orb for max power.

  22. #297
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    Ok since this is dead, here is the final version of the team. Now the next voting stage will be on what tier we want the next CCAT to be in! Any of the main tiers will do. The list is Ubers, UU, RU, NU, and LC. Please bold your votes. Voting will last for 1 week or until it has been 48 hours without a post to avoid having this thread die again. Happy voting

        Spoiler:- CCAT2:
    Last edited by Sparkbeat; 1st August 2013 at 5:14 PM.

    Trainer Level 3 Squad | Alpha Sapphire Team - - En Route from Petalburg to Slateport via Ocean | WF Quest Log

  23. #298
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    Voting for Ubers since Ubers is amazing.


    I look sugary and sweet, but in reality I'm just hollow and rotten.
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  24. #299
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    RU because sexy

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  25. #300
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    Voting RU since RU is amazing.

    Credit to Ayra for the profile pic.
    ASB squad- http://www.serebiiforums.com/showthr...0#post16972170
    I have claimed Kabutops, destroyer of all! Fear me or perish!

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