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Thread: Pokemon league patterns?

  1. #1
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    Default Pokemon league patterns?

    Every second gen, ash has used his old pokemon, do you think this will continue to his next league in kalos?

    Also, in Sinnoh, many of ash's pokemon werent used in battle? Was this intentional to set up which pokes return in the kalos league?

    Other topics may be discussed including amount of rivals desired, and how far you think ash will come in XY
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    Really good chance, considering they heavily base stuff off the games, And gen 3 and 5 basically were both complete fresh starts if you ignore azurill and wynaut. Gen 6 definitely will have plenty of old gen stuff.
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    It's probably tied to how even generations tend to rely more on older gens while odd ones are more detached. At the moment Kalos looks like it's going to be somewhere between those two trends (it's got older Pokemon and apparently additional evos, but it's distant from the other regions the way Unova was), so it'll be interesting to see how this translates to the league and the anime in general.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Pokememes View Post
    Every second gen, ash has used his old pokemon, do you think this will continue to his next league in kalos?

    Also, in Sinnoh, many of ash's pokemon werent used in battle? Was this intentional to set up which pokes return in the kalos league?
    Every odd numbered generation is a fresh start/reboot

    Every even numbered generation is a generation to look forward to when it comes to the real stuff! i.e Battles, leagues, rivals, movies and what-not

    Hoenn was the only exception cuz Hoenn was a reboot done right :3

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    AG and Best Wishes were both intended to be reboots. And its sad when the AG version of Ash was a better and more competent trainer than his BW counterpart, showing how his team and skills did worse in the league even if it was the same rank.

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    Quote Originally Posted by CyberCubed View Post
    AG and Best Wishes were both intended to be reboots. And its sad when the AG version of Ash was a better and more competent trainer than his BW counterpart, showing how his team and skills did worse in the league even if it was the same rank.
    It seems like pretty much every trainer is dumbed down in BW.

    Which is a bit bizarre, as Ingame BW/B2W2 has the trainers have higher AI then the Hoenn and Sinnoh games :P

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    Quote Originally Posted by CyberCubed View Post
    AG and Best Wishes were both intended to be reboots. And its sad when the AG version of Ash was a better and more competent trainer than his BW counterpart, showing how his team and skills did worse in the league even if it was the same rank.
    Ash didnt really reset in gen 3 to the point of forgetting how to catch Pokemon, but I do agree on paper Ash's unova team should have done better, he had a team of competent mons who were screwed for the more marketable mons.
    Last edited by LizardonX; 30th June 2013 at 4:15 PM.

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    I wouldn't say that Sinnoh didn't that will on showing off the Sinnoh Pokemon. I want to the Kalos Pokemon to be shown and not see the older Pokemon to much.



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    Quote Originally Posted by dirkac View Post
    It seems like pretty much every trainer is dumbed down in BW.

    Which is a bit bizarre, as Ingame BW/B2W2 has the trainers have higher AI then the Hoenn and Sinnoh games :P
    The in-game AIs of BW2 surprised me as well. I was recently playing through White 2 and was fighting a Grunt with a Scrafty on the Team Plasma Frigate, and he actually predicted. I had an Espeon out and switched in Lucario thinking that a Crunch was going to happen, and I got clocked with a Hi Jump Kick. Since when can computers predict like that?!

    Speaking of the games, it feels weird how abilities were so common in Hoenn and Sinnoh, yet when we were going through Unova, they were hardly ever used. I think abilities only activated...at least 4 or 6 times throughout the entire Unova saga. There's Iris's Emolga using Static against Stephan's Sawk in the first Don Tournament, Pikachu using Static against Roxie's Garbodor, Ash's Leavanny's Swarm activating during the Unova League, a Venipede using Poison Touch during that one episode in Castelia City, and maybe Cilan's Dwebble using Sturdy in his first battle against Burgandy and Roggenrola using Sturdy in the battle against Clay. You could probably count Clay's Excadrill using Sand Rush/Sand Force while the Sandstorm was up, but it was never mentioned, so I don't think it counts.
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    Lots of misuse for the term reboot here. Ruby and Sapphire was a reboot, but the anime was not. It was the same Ash, same Team Rocket and same Brock on new adventures. A fresh start and a reboot are completely different things. Gen V didn't reboot anything. It just wanted to capture the feel Kanto had. The anime just took it too far and brought back the feeling of Ash going on his first adventure, which makes no sense.

    I think it has less to do with whether or not the games provide a reboot/fresh start or not and more to do with what the generation brings us.

    Gen 2 - Kanto was still part of the games, and Ash's Kanto team was still pretty relevant
    Gen 3 - With a trip to Kanto coming up, there was no reason to reintroduce Ash's older team in the league. With a Gen 1 remake and the league behind them, Ash's older Pokémon became relevant again
    Gen 4 - With a Gen 2 remake, Quilava, Noctowl, Donphan and Heracross became relevant again. HGSS also had Hoenn Pokémon and the door was open for Ash to see some of his Hoenn team again anyway
    Gen 5 - There were no remakes to speak of and BW1 was all about Unova only. Plus Ash had a large team to rotate so there was little room for past Pokémon


    So with XY it depends on if we're getting remakes and how many Kalos Pokémon he catches really. It could be a repeat of Gen V for all we know.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SlimeStack View Post
    It could be a repeat of Gen V for all we know.
    Don't say such things!

    But I agree with you, the anime hasn't truly "rebooted" at all, same Ash, Same Pikachu, same TR, same Plot devices

    The thing with BW saga is that they wanted a fresh start, but it seems like they didn't quite know how to handle it. Having Ash lose to Trip, and the horrible way Palpi and Dirty Bird were treated weren't even factors. We've seen Ash lose to rivals, We've seen Pokemon get shafted, but this is the first time since Johto where we really didn't see our protagonist grow.

    I watched the important episodes of BW and it didn't give me that feeling of nostalgia they were going for it juts made me upset for following the anime this far, here we have Ash who has been in multiple Leagues, fought Elites, Gym after bloody Gym and Unova makes it seem as though it was all for nothing. It wasn't like DP where we saw Ash get progressively better over the course of the saga, In BW he started one way and he ended that way and was really a bit of a disappointment

    My only hopes for the XY saga is that they realize this mistake and just show us a competent Ash that can handle himself in a battle without struggling every step of the way, and an Ash that actually knows his stuff, after all he's been around for a while

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    Ash would win a league if he was about to leave the show right?
    I get that may and dawn didn't win a grand festival, but ash is the main protagonist
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pokememes View Post
    Ash would win a league if he was about to leave the show right?
    I get that may and dawn didn't win a grand festival, but ash is the main protagonist
    He won't ever leave the show, he is here to the end, so that is when he will. So he might win in like 100 years or whenever the games stop being made.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pokememes View Post
    Ash would win a league if he was about to leave the show right?
    I get that may and dawn didn't win a grand festival, but ash is the main protagonist
    He will win a league when he evolves his Pokemon. Look at the Silver Conference for example. He came so close because his Pokemon were evolved.

    And the only reason he didnt win Sinnoh is because Tobias had those legendary Pokemon.
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    A sort of pattern as well is Ash not facinng game Rivals in the League.

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    You know, I always thought Tobias appeared because they had to finish up the league in one episode rather than appearing only to stop Ash. They mentioned the E4 and champion league a lot and coincidentally they developed Ash's skills to the point where winning would be possible.

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    Normally I would agree that we could see the old teammates again...but this last league threw out all my expectations. I thought it was obvious with the number of reserves had this time around that he'd make Top 4 quite easily in one of the weakest leagues to date, turns out the writers felt he should do worst though. Would I like to see him do this?, sure...am I expecting it?, no.
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    Quote Originally Posted by AceOfSpadez View Post
    He will win a league when he evolves his Pokemon. Look at the Silver Conference for example. He came so close because his Pokemon were evolved.

    And the only reason he didnt win Sinnoh is because Tobias had those legendary Pokemon.
    I agree. Almost all of Ash's Sinnoh Pokémon evolved except for Pikachu (duh), Buizel (is already pretty powerful and beat evolved form), and Gible (caught near the end of Sinnoh). Ash could have won the Sinnoh League if the writers didn't decide to give Tobias legendaries. Also, there was someone with a Heatran but we did not see them battle.

    As for older Pokémon in the Kalos League, I hope Ash uses some and they get some wins. Poor Torkoal, Quilava, and Swellow. It really depends if Ash catches a lot of new Pokémon because if he catches a lot, we might not see some old Pokémon. I think 7 or 8 is good as long as they get good screentime.
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    As long as Ash doesn't have an extra team of reserves, it's possible.

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    I won't lie I look at BW and can't help but feel it is almost filler. If it was a full on continuation like Hoenn and Sinnoh and did not try to be Kanto 2.0 I 'm sure Ash could of got second if not win it. If they did not regress him I could see him with Dewott,Semistoad,Emboar,Serpiror and maybe a Scrafty. (Might of just been Scraggy however) TBH I'm shocked he made Top 8. He hardly did training compared to other regions so Top 8 is lucky. Really hope that training persona of his returns

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    It's possible. It would be nice for Gible or one of his water types to get another chance to evolve.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MidnightMelody View Post
    I won't lie I look at BW and can't help but feel it is almost filler. If it was a full on continuation like Hoenn and Sinnoh and did not try to be Kanto 2.0 I 'm sure Ash could of got second if not win it. If they did not regress him I could see him with Dewott,Semistoad,Emboar,Serpiror and maybe a Scrafty. (Might of just been Scraggy however) TBH I'm shocked he made Top 8. He hardly did training compared to other regions so Top 8 is lucky. Really hope that training persona of his returns
    I agree, if ash really wanted to contend, he could have had his current team, while evolving snivy to serperior, palpitoad to seismitoad and maybe oshawott or scraggy
    That would've given him more power, while keeping a scrub or two so he don't seem OP
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    Quote Originally Posted by Joltik-Kid View Post
    Normally I would agree that we could see the old teammates again...but this last league threw out all my expectations. I thought it was obvious with the number of reserves had this time around that he'd make Top 4 quite easily in one of the weakest leagues to date, turns out the writers felt he should do worst though. Would I like to see him do this?, sure...am I expecting it?, no.
    they could've done that to make people realize Ash isn't always going to rank the same way everytime, after all that would get as repeptitive as some of the other things that are repetitive.

    Plus given that the unova league had more participants than the sinnoh league, Ash sorta did come out the same way when it came to the number of trainers he faught.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Almighty Zard View Post
    they could've done that to make people realize Ash isn't always going to rank the same way everytime, after all that would get as repeptitive as some of the other things that are repetitive.

    Plus given that the unova league had more participants than the sinnoh league, Ash sorta did come out the same way when it came to the number of trainers he faught.
    Actually I think they just skipped over the prelims in Sinnoh. xD
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    Quote Originally Posted by J Ken View Post
    Actually I think they just skipped over the prelims in Sinnoh. xD
    there would've been some mention if that was the case but it wasn't, we went from Ash checking out his older guys to jumping straight into the tournament, unless you want to say his fight with nando was preliminary.

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