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Thread: Mewtwo ~ The Prologue to Awakening (BWSP1)

  1. #51

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    Quote Originally Posted by Crimson_Blazer View Post
    how do you explain this then?
    On February 15, 2013, the film's subsequent subtitle was released, revealing the inclusion of Mewtwo in the film. Yuyama's statement on the official website for the film explains that Mewtwo has changed after traveling the world following the events of Mewtwo Returns.
    Quote Originally Posted by Spin Attaxx View Post
    Yuyama probably lied about that to hide the fact it was different.
    Quote Originally Posted by Pepsi_Plunge View Post
    Either lied or changed ideas, I think he just changed ideas personally, pretty cheap if he lied just to promote the movie, well its marketing but still pretty damn shady.
    The explanation is simple enough: "Yuyama's statement was mistranslated".
    This has been explained before. He never once stated this Mewtwo was the same as before, his statements were just worded in a way that made it a bit unclear whether he meant this was a different Mewtwo, or the same Mewtwo who had been changed by its more recent experiences.
    I'm not sure where the translation Crimson Blazer quotes comes from, but it's not a correct one. It was explained back in February what he had actually said.

    Also, him stating he "felt it would be better if this was a different Mewtwo" is him talking as a director. It fit the story better for the Mewtwo to be a different Mewtwo. It really isn't something to get so hung up about.
    Last edited by Dephender; 11th July 2013 at 8:35 PM.

  2. #52
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    So, Oldtwo is going to be completely ignored (like it never existed) in favor of Newtwo huh? Stupid, but I digress. The special didn't look too bad, though.

    Edit: Since the creator said that Newtwo would be better suited, I won't complain about it. Besides, Newtwo is really growing on me.
    Last edited by Iblistech; 11th July 2013 at 8:36 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by CyberCubed View Post
    They're purposely leaving it ambiguous so its up to fans to decide if its the same Mewtwo or not. People said Ash doesn't even say anything about the old Mewtwo in the movie so there's no contradictions.
    What? No. It's obviously a different Mewtwo.

  4. #54
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    I just looked at the screenshots... can anyone explain why this Mewtwo, whether it be the same one or not, is so weak? It seemed like it got its arse handed to it.
    Last edited by Regality; 11th July 2013 at 9:14 PM.

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    So as expected, nothing was explained? Figures. I think the audience was expected to be enthralled by the superior animation, which was gorgeous I'm not gonna lie (why can't the regular anime have such fantastic animation), but that wasn't what this prologue should have been about imo. I really wanted the plot holes to be covered, but that didn't happen. We have no idea how this new Mewtwo came to be and that's just bad storytelling imo.

  6. #56
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    I like the fact that it is a new Mewtwo. It's backstory will likely be revealed in the games but not the anime, like Rotom.

    It's nice seeing Virgil but his Eeveelutions did squat. The only ones who did something were Espeon, Umbreon, and Vaporeon.



  7. #57

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    Quote Originally Posted by _Taidow_ View Post
    I like the fact that it is a new Mewtwo. It's backstory will likely be revealed in the games but not the anime, like Rotom.

    It's nice seeing Virgil but his Eeveelutions did squat. The only ones who did something were Espeon, Umbreon, and Vaporeon.
    Seems Leafeon is the anime's butt monkey unlike his anime superior cousin Flareon.

  8. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by Regality View Post
    I just looked at the screenshots... can anyone explain why this Mewtwo, whether it be the same one or not, is so weak? It seemed like it got its arse handed to it.
    It wasn't weak, Escavalier and Tyranitar didn't do anthing to him actually, it was the machines that the evil dude used that did some damage.

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    Quote Originally Posted by _Taidow_ View Post
    I like the fact that it is a new Mewtwo. It's backstory will likely be revealed in the games but not the anime, like Rotom.
    Since the games =/= anime, any information about Mewtwo in the new games will likely not be canon. I don't see why the director didn't at least try to come up with a good explanation for the new Mewtwo. I mean this prologue special was the perfect opportunity for that, but it didn't happen. Speaking of which, I honestly felt that Virgil and his Eevee team were redundant. They didn't do nearly as much as they could've done. They just sort of stood there for promo reasons. :c

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pepsi_Plunge View Post
    CotD weren't bland, villan wasn't bland.
    Anna and Oscar didn't really have anything special to do in this, Virgil almost literally did nothing, and Danku was little more than a blend of Vicious, Domino and J. Admittedly, he was the best character, but in a cast this weak, it's not saying much.

    It sure looked like Mewtwo Q killed Danku at the end, too, because after it attacked him, I don't think he was seen again.

    Mewtwo appeared a lot and came off pretty well out of this.
    Mewtwo Q only made two short appearances prior to the mid-episode eyecatch by my count, and despite their opportunity, there is still literally nothing making it a memorable character on its own. If you strip away everything that was blatantly lifted from the real Mewtwo, all that remains to distinguish it is the female voice and the Awakened Form.

    It doesn't help that this episode was basically the same thing as Mewtwo Returns with Team Rocket removed. Both have Mewtwo escaping from its creators, going to a place where sympathetic Pokémon are with it, being pursued by its creators, meeting a group consisting of both existing characters and COTDs, being attacked by a villain who disguised themselves as a hero, and ultimately overcoming machines deployed against it and soundly defeating the villain.

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  11. #61

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    Quote Originally Posted by The Great Butler View Post
    It sure looked like Mewtwo Q killed Danku at the end, too, because after it attacked him, I don't think he was seen again.
    Anna, Oscar and Virgil took him with them and delivered to to the police.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pepsi_Plunge View Post
    It wasn't weak, Escavalier and Tyranitar didn't do anthing to him actually, it was the machines that the evil dude used that did some damage.
    Oh right, awesome!
    I will have to watch it instead of quickly looking at the screenshots.

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    Quote Originally Posted by The Great Butler View Post
    It doesn't help that this episode was basically the same thing as Mewtwo Returns with Team Rocket removed. Both have Mewtwo escaping from its creators, going to a place where sympathetic Pokémon are with it, being pursued by its creators, meeting a group consisting of both existing characters and COTDs, being attacked by a villain who disguised themselves as a hero, and ultimately overcoming machines deployed against it and soundly defeating the villain.
    Exactly. Except that Mewtwo Returns did it better by having the disuised villain part of Team Rocket, and the villain Mewtwo soundly defeats the leader of Team Rocket. With the Team Rocket element and pre-existing backstory stripped away, this is a hollow shell of a great story.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dephender View Post
    Also, him stating he "felt it would be better if this was a different Mewtwo" is him talking as a director. It fit the story better for the Mewtwo to be a different Mewtwo. It really isn't something to get so hung up about.
    I'd buy that if they didn't rip off so much of the original Mewtwo's backstory, making it redundant for it to be a different Mewtwo.
    Last edited by AgentPierce; 12th July 2013 at 3:15 AM.

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    I really, really want to know what the Japanese's reaction is to this. You know Japan has fans that are as old as we are as well as the younger viewers. Wonder what they think of all this.
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  15. #65

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    Got the full cast list up. Note all the recasting that went on here. Almost all of Virgil's Pokémon have new VAs now. Compare with the BWS2-17 voice cast list.

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    The animation was stunning. Maybe XY can adopt it for every episode. It couldn't have been that much more expensive.

    There was unfortunately nothing that important about it, but it was still better than a Da episode.. Newtwo wasn't explained, the Awakened form went unexplained, and it barely associates with M16 except for Ash, Cilan and Iris appearing at the end.

    I applaud the aggressiveness though. Mewtwo was pissed and even released Tyranitar and Escavalier. Intense.

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  17. #67

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    Quote Originally Posted by Shneak View Post
    and it barely associates with M16 except for Ash, Cilan and Iris appearing at the end.
    That's not true. It take place between two flashbacks to Mewtwo's past that happen in the movie, and also explains his coldness towards humans pretty well.

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    I suppose it would be too soon to introduce the Genesects. After all, Mewtwo inserts itself into their plot. I basically wanted the prologue to the prologue to be fleshed out better.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dephender View Post
    That's not true. It take place between two flashbacks to Mewtwo's past that happen in the movie, and also explains his coldness towards humans pretty well.
    Which would be nice if this whole thing wasn't retreaded territory from the real Mewtwo, just condensed into an extremely abridged form.

    This thing is seriously the most wafer-thin character I think I've ever seen in this anime. It has no distinguishing characteristics of its own.

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  20. #70
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    Alright special nothing great outside of animation but aside from showing off Mewtwo's new form before the movie did it really serve any purpose?

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    Okay, so I watched the prologue once I discovered the English sub was released. I prepared myself prior to watching it, and I jotted down notes throughout. I made sure to pause the video and write down notes as they came to me. I'll just say first off that this prologue was pointless and only just made me mad at the end. Here is what I noted pretty much from beginning to end:

    - At least the opening is hook-worthy, I'll give them that.

    - Virgil, Anna, and her grandfather are uninteresting characters, and they are pointless. All they do is just stand around doing nothing. Yeah, there was that one time where Virgil showed off his rescuing skills, but it was a dumb rescue (due to it being an obvious trick), and after that, he did nothing. Okay, yeah, his team tried to put out the fire, but they just made it worse, and then they just stood around looking like deer in headlights.

    - Danku was an obvious villain in his introduction, sneaking around like that and pulling up his makeshift sling. I don't know if that's what they were going for to show he was the bad guy, but that made his obvious reveal not shock-worthy. His voice is sexy (it's Nougami Neuro's voice actor, after all), but that's the only good thing about him. He wasn't threatening, he just stood around giving orders to his Pokémon, and once they left him (I will admit that Newtwo crushing the PokéBalls was neat), he just gave up and they hauled him off to jail. Some Pokémon Hunter he is. For someone who did something similar in a previous movie, the Iron-Masked Marauder was more threatening than him because he did stuff.

    Danku, not even your voice actor could save you. You are disappointing, and you look like a human Lucario.

    - Anna's flashback apparently lost context or lost control of its narrative. She's remembering the time when Stoutland saved her (even said so herself), but then all of a sudden it goes to when Newtwo saved them. I know they were connected, but why keep the flashback going like that instead of having the grandfather cutting in or something by saying, "But wait, there's more!"? Now I don't know if she was the one telling the flashback by the end or not.

    - Newtwo's glowing eyes are scary, by the way.

    - Virgil is an ass. "I wanna hire this unknown Pokémon onto my rescue team despite having all Eevees!" I don't know him well as a character, so I don't know if he was like this in the show as well, but that made me roll my eyes at him.

    - Wait... Pokémon who are "trapped" can't be recalled back into PokéBalls? Wouldn't any of them have questioned why he couldn't just do that from the start? Was this ever established that Pokémon can't be recalled into their balls under certain circumstances?

    - Water in a cavern that goes underground? An obvious Cerulean Cave or Mount Quena reference if I ever saw one. Also, the Azumarill and Marill were pointless, they disappeared right after pointing Eevee and Stoutland to the cavern. Gee, thanks for contributing to the plot, your check's in the mail!

    - Not going to go into it because the movie thread is full of it anyway, but yes, Newtwo was made from Mew DNA and looks like Mewtwo somehow. This will still piss me off no matter how much it's "explained".

    - Flashback has an obvious pose from the electric torture scene of Mewtwo Returns.

    - Um, Virgil, you don't know what a Mewtwo looks like. So how would your Pokémon know what it looks like?

    - Oh, Anna is friends with the Pokémon in the forest. And she can call them in a prayer? Really? Unless it's a reference to the Shinto religion or whatever, or she's somehow a fairy/forest sprite/magical being, I'm calling bull on that. The fact that the Pokémon do absolutely nothing afterwards is further proof of it. Thanks for being more useless, Anna.

    - Newtwo's voice actress may be a good voice actress for all I know (I don't know what other roles she's done), but GOD the voice doesn't fit the appearance of this character. Like, at all.

    - By the way, who the hell hired Danku if the laboratory was destroyed? How did he know what happened there? Were the flashback sequences (which may be movie footage) really necessary? And how did Newtwo know it could transform? And how the hell did Danku not know about it? Gee, for a prologue that's supposed to explain the "awakening", it didn't explain jack.

    - Anna cries over Newtwo for no apparent reason. What was she sorry for anyway? She didn't do anything. Gotta make her cute somehow! >_>

    - There was an obvious Mewtwo Returns attempt with the machines, but it was less dramatic, and it was over with quickly. Okay, yeah, justified because in Mewtwo Returns, Mewtwo did it willingly in order to keep his clones safe. So if he were to ever break out (which he apparently had the power to do, even though by that time it nearly killed him), Giovanni would order the clones experimented on without hesitation. Newtwo here may have been weak, but it fought off the machines fine. Then it goes on to just put out the fire easily with a cyclone of water from a nearby lake. Some climax.

    And then this is where the prologue pissed me off.

    Newtwo, as it watched the fire spread, went on to say to itself, "I am the strongest Pokémon ever made" before putting out the fire. BULL. SHIT. If Newtwo is the strongest Pokémon ever, it wouldn't have spend all that time fighting the Tyranitar and Escavalier, it would've defeated them easily! Or hell, it wouldn't have gotten injured so easily! Newtwo wouldn't have given Danku the time of day if it were the strongest! I get it, it's a "newborn", but Mewtwo was stronger than that despite being minutes old. It may have been egotistical for him to claim after blowing up the lab that he's the strongest Pokémon in the world, but it was true! We saw proof of it almost immediately afterwards! But what did Newtwo do? It laid around in water and just showed off its unexplained forme while having the fight unnecessarily prolonged. There should have been no excuse for the weaknesses of Steel and Dark going up against it.

    Of course, then it gets worse in that Newtwo turns out to be a bitch by telling the humans--after putting out the fire--"I just saved Pokémon." Then why did it save the humans? To make it more infuriating, Anna, her grandfather and Virgil just shrug it off and say thanks anyway. Yeah, yeah, it's polite, but still, one of them should've called it out on it being rude. Then it goes on to say "forget you ever met me" and just flies off without doing anything? What did it expect, that humans are goldfish and forget things like that?

    So there you go. My qualms with the prologue. It did nothing to explain like it was advertised to do. If anything, it just further proved that Newtwo should've never been created, because it was obvious that you could replace Newtwo with the original Mewtwo and it would've had the same effect if this had happened at any time prior to the first movie, or even during Mewtwo Returns. The characters were even more pointless by just filling in space. Outside of explaining their own flashback, they did nothing. The only good thing about the prologue was the animation and the fight sequences, but even then, it was obvious the fight sequences were just there to fill in the gaps because the writers were too lazy to actually put in proper explanation for the new forme. Seriously, if they got rid of the fight or at least shortened it (because the "world's strongest" shouldn't have to spend five-plus minutes fighting them), they would've been able to explain the forme instead of just showing it off.

    What a dreadful prologue. The hype wasn't worth it, and it only further fueled my dislike toward Newtwo. Good job, Oriental Light and Magic, for wasting all that time and money writing and animating a pointless prologue when it could've gone towards something else. You must be proud of yourself.
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  22. #72

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    I pretty much agree with your review Kutie Pie. You mentioned the strongest parts of this special (read Takehito Koyasu) and the meh ones. I never watched it subtitlet, so I'm quite surprised the writers went with the "I am the strongest Pokemon in the universe!" text for Mewtwo again. First of all, I understand it was fine in Kanto since Mewtwo was truly the most powerful one, only equal to it's original Mew, but not now. We are after Arceus already.

  23. #73

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nightstar1994 View Post
    I'm quite surprised the writers went with the "I am the strongest Pokemon in the universe!" text for Mewtwo again. First of all, I understand it was fine in Kanto since Mewtwo was truly the most powerful one, only equal to it's original Mew, but not now. We are after Arceus already.
    They didn't, the subtitles Kutie Pie watched were full of mistranslations and made-up nonsense. Several of the complaints about the writings are just about things that weren't translated properly.

  24. #74
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    Yeah this episode was completely pointless, sad to see that that the writers continue not to care about their own canon, and Kutie Pie's basically said what I wanted to say.
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  25. #75

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    I honestly didn't think we were getting this in the dub, nonetheless a couple months after the movie airing. I'm excited! Maybe we'll get some of the other so-far unaired specials eventually, too (Dawn and Brock w/ Cilan and Iris' later on).

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