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Thread: Community POTW #138

  1. #1
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    Default Community POTW #138

    Time for the next Pokémon of the Week, and this time we have another fan favourite



    It's Gliscor, the awesome evolution of Gligar. It has a beastly Attack and is capable of dealing some serious damage

    http://www.serebii.net/pokedex-bw/472.shtml

    Go nuts

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    Gliscor
    Item: Toxic Orb
    Ability: Poison Heal
    Nature: Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
    EVs: 252 Atk / 80 Sp. Def / 176 Spe

    - Swords Dance/Hone Claws
    - Earthquake
    - Stone Edge
    - Thunder Fang/Ice Fang
    Last edited by Lucario At Service; 18th August 2013 at 1:16 PM.

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    Personally, THIS OU POKEMON JUST DOES NOT WANT TO DDDIIIIIIIIIIIIEEEEEEEEEEEEE!!!!

    Seriously, without any water or Ice type pokemon, this thing will kill you before you even take it down. What's worse is that it's fast. Of all the ground types with Landorus in OU. For me, this is why I hated using a choice scarf pokemon but I had to do so just to beat this guy's ***.

    Personally, I'm not sure if the Substitute + Toxic Orb + Poison Heal + Roost is still legal in generation 5. I heard that this set is banned in D/P/Pt. Does that mean that this set is still banned? I'm sure that it holds either Earthquake, Ice Fang, or Stone Edge as its attack move.

    But geesh. Can't there be a way to counter and check this fast bulky glacier pokemon WITHOUT a choice scarfed Pokemon? I hate choice scarf.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jireh the provider View Post
    Personally, THIS OU POKEMON JUST DOES NOT WANT TO DDDIIIIIIIIIIIIEEEEEEEEEEEEE!!!!

    Seriously, without any water or Ice type pokemon, this thing will kill you before you even take it down. What's worse is that it's fast. Of all the ground types with Landorus in OU. For me, this is why I hated using a choice scarf pokemon but I had to do so just to beat this guy's ***.

    Personally, I'm not sure if the Substitute + Toxic Orb + Poison Heal + Roost is still legal in generation 5. I heard that this set is banned in D/P/Pt. Does that mean that this set is still banned? I'm sure that it holds either Earthquake, Ice Fang, or Stone Edge as its attack move.

    But geesh. Can't there be a way to counter and check this fast bulky glacier pokemon WITHOUT a choice scarfed Pokemon? I hate choice scarf.
    I think Slowbro is a fairly decent counter. It has the bulk to take Gliscors moves, especially with Regenerator and Slack off. Gliscor only has base 95 attack, which isn't all that much when you consider it pretty much never runs choice band or life orb. Slowbro also has Ice Beam to destroy Gliscor with.
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    It's safe to assume it was banned in DPPt as Gliscor didn't get Poison Heal until it gained Dream World abilities in Gen 5.

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    Gligar's much needed evolution from generation 4, with a solid typing and defenses this guy/girl takes a lot to take down.

    Pros:Gliscor's typing does it a lot of favors. Having two immunities and three resistances is quite handy, especially if there are only two weaknesses in return. Gliscor's physical defense stat is very high at base 125. Couple that with a decent base HP, an immunity to earthquake and a resistance to fighting and you have a premier physical wall. It's movepool is rather large too, allowing one to take advantage of its slightly better than average attack stat, or going full support. Earthquake, Acrobatics, Sky Uppercut, U-Turn, Aqua Tail, Night Slash, and Swords Dance are the makings for a physical sweeper, while weather moves, Stealth Rock, Taunt, Substitute, Toxic, and Tailwind constitute Gliscor's support moveset. But the main reason Gliscor has such staying power in OU is its dream world ability; Poison Heal. Thanks to this Gliscor can hold a toxic orb and get healed a Twice the rate of leftovers. That means while Gliscor is poisoned, it is immune to all other primary statuses at its benefit, making it much more difficult. A passing mention should be made to Gliscor's Speed, which while slower than many of the Elite Sweepers of OU, at a base 95 still allows Gliscor to prey on bulkier pokemon.

    Cons:While Gliscor's physical defense is amazing, its special defense leaves much to be desired. In addition, its two weaknesse are largely special based; Water and ICE. Ice clips this batman's wings extremely fast; with a x4 weakness to ice Gliscor fears ice attacks as heavily as Dragon Flying types do. While normal status throwing can't hit Gliscor due to poison heal (unless you get it on the switch with anything BUT poison), the toxic orb Gliscor is so fond of holding can be its own enemy; if you can remove Poison Heal, the toxic damage would be the same as what Gliscor should be taking {i.e. if you remove Poison Heal on the eighth turn Gliscor has been in battle, badly poisoning will take half of its hp}. Since Gliscor tends to carry Stab moves only, Skarmory can wall the wall, but is walled in turn. Aerodatcyl and Archeops resists both STABS but can struggle to damage it and would be screwed by Toxic. Bulky waters overall work best, often walling Gliscor's attacks a striking back with a STAB surf or ice beam. They just have to watch out for toxic.

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    Gliscor. I love this thing. It's not Spectacular on Stats, but the Movepool and Abilities more than make up for it. Plus, it just looks friggin' cool.

    Stats:
    -HP - Slightly-Above Average - Base 75 is a decent starting point for a Flying Type, but not so much for a Ground Type.
    -Attack - Good-bordering-Great - Base 95 is really good for a Flying Type, but somewhat-lackluster for a Ground Type.
    -Defense - Slightly-Above Godly - Base 125 is incredible for a Flying Type and somewhat-huge for a Ground Type.
    -Sp.Atk - Bad - Base 45 is worthy of spitting on the ground and uttering an invective...makes it quite easy to build a Physical Moveset, now.
    -Sp.Def - Slightly-Below Average - Base 75 is pretty normal for a Flying Type, but pretty good for a Ground Type.
    -Speed - Good (non-Trick Room) - Base 95 is decent for an Attacker to get hits in, but could be higher. Fortunately, you're a bit tank-y, Gliscor.

    Abilities:
    -Hyper Cutter - Pretty solid Ability. Prevents Intimidate and allows you to maintain Attack buffs.
    -Sand Veil - Decent Ability. Evasion-hax is frowned upon, but is a legit strategy. Plus, Tyranitar and Hippopotas/Hippowdon are decent allies anyway.
    -Poison Heal (DW) - Really? You have a Pokémon that's already cool and solid in a fight and you give it this? WHY DID YOU WAIT SO LONG, GAMEFREAK?!?!?! You just cranked the volume up to Awesome...puts more emphasis on the tank-y aspect and protects you from other Status Effects (just watch out for Hex and, to a much-lesser extent, Venoshock)

    Regarding your Movepool, you have STAB Earthquake, Slash, Façade, elemental Fangs, STAB Acrobatics, STAB Aerial Ace, U-Turn, X-Scissor, Cross Poison, Poison Jab, Night Slash, Knock Off, Sky Uppercut, Brick Break, Steel Wing, Iron Tail, Rock Slide, Stone Edge, Aqua Tail, and a plethora of awesome Status Moves like Hone Claws, Swords Dance, and Rock Polish. Most Normal Types would kill for that kind of coverage and/or Attack.
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    Yesss!! Finally! One of my favorite competitive Pokemon!
    This is the set I currently run:

    Gliscor
    Toxic
    Substitute
    Earthquake
    Protect
    Item: Toxic Orb
    Ability: Poison Heal
    Nature: Careful/Impish
    EVs: 252 HP, 126 Def, 130 Sdef

    Toxic the opponent while Toxic Orb+Poison Heal keeps you alive. Then Substitute and Protect until your opponent switches/dies. Rinse and repeat. Earthquake is a basic attacking move if you ever need it. You should max out the PP of Protect to last out Pressure (if you ever face it). EVs are designed to give the Substitute a lot of HP and increase Gliscor's bulk, especially against (God forbid) Ice-type attacks. Impish Nature for more Defense and Careful for more Special Defense.

    Counters
    Breloom with Poison Heal can screw up Gliscor's strategy.
    Ice-type attackers like Cloyster can make Gliscor suffer.
    Steels and Poisons (they can't be Poisoned)
    SKARMORY. The bird is immune to Toxic AND Earthquake.
    Also, it's a very predictable moveset.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sceptile Leaf Blade View Post
    I think Slowbro is a fairly decent counter. It has the bulk to take Gliscors moves, especially with Regenerator and Slack off. Gliscor only has base 95 attack, which isn't all that much when you consider it pretty much never runs choice band or life orb. Slowbro also has Ice Beam to destroy Gliscor with.
    Slowbro can't really deal with ToxicSub Stall Gliscor. If Slowbro gets poisoned on the switch, its awful speed means that between Sub and Protect, Slowbro will never be hitting Gliscor directly, and proceed to have to either switch out or get stalled to death. Barring Trick Room intervention, of course.

    Counters

    Gliscor's one of those Pokemon whose counters really depend on what moves its running.

    Skarmory
    - Gliscor can't really do anything to Skarmory, as its immune to Toxic and Earthquake, takes pittance from Acrobatics and Ice Fang, and can just set up hazards or whirlwind Gliscor away to get rid of its Sub and any boosts. However, if Gliscor has Taunt, then Skarmory won't be able to do anything to it, either, as Brave Bird won't do much to the physically bulky Gliscor.

    Gengar - Gengar laughs at Sub Stalling sets, as it's immune to Toxic and Earthquake, and isn't crippled by Taunt as it can just pound away at Gliscor's poor Special Defense. However, Gengar is frail, so it can get shredded by Acrobatics and doesn't like eating Ice Fangs or Stone Edges either.

    Rotom-W - Rotom-W deals with offensive sets without difficulty, as its immune to Earthquake, resists both Ice Fang and Acrobatics, can usually take a Stone Edge, and can 1HKO with either Hydro Pump or HP Ice. In addition, many Rotom-W's carry Will-o-Wisp, and if they can get that off before Toxic Orb activates, Gliscor will be crippled (there is a very small window of opportunity to do this, though). However, Rotom-W is susceptible to Toxic Stalling, so it has to be wary of what set Gliscor is running when it switches in.

    Cloyster - Cloyster makes a decent check, as it is not 2HKO'd by anything barring the odd Stone Edge (and hitting 2 Stone Edges in a row can sometimes be asking for a lot) due to its physical bulk, and Icicle Spear + Skill Link has no trouble killing Gliscor even if it's behind a Sub. It doesn't like eating Toxics though, and boosted attacks can potentially be a bit much for it to handle.

    Mamomswine - Mamoswine is largely in the same boat as Cloyster, though without Skill Link, its Icicle Spears are far less reliable. Mamoswine's Ice Shards can be a headache for Gliscor, but with a Sub up, Mamoswine can run into trouble with that and be forced to eat Toxic.

    Sabeleye - Sableye can be an incredibly situational counter. Like Rotom-W, it can try to burn Gliscor with Will-o-Wisp (aided by Prankster) to circumvent Poison Heal, but there's only a single turn to do this. Likewise, Sableye's Prankstered Taunts can prevent Gliscor from stalling at all. Sableye's pretty frail and can't eat boosted attacks though, but it can Recover stall Gliscor's PP away on unboosted attacks.

    Faster Pokemon with good special attack can revenge kill Gliscor without much difficulty, especially if it's not behind a sub. Things like Keldeo, Starmie, and Jolteon carrying HP Ice can all prey on Gliscor's poor special defense, but many of them have difficulty switching in. Things like Latios, Latias, and Thundurus-T (again with HP Ice) are great at checking Gliscor as well, as they can often nab a free switch in if you predict an Earthquake. However, none of them like Toxic or Ice Fang, so they have to be careful on what they switch into.

    And of course, faster Pokemon with Taunt can shut down Stall Gliscors, forcing them out. SubToxic Gliscor in particular is very vulnerable to taunt, as it usually carried only one offensive move, which is usually Earthquake.
    Last edited by KillerDraco; 18th August 2013 at 3:43 PM.
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    On the offensive
    Impish
    Poison Heal
    Toxic Orb
    EV's 252 HP, 200 def, 48 speed, 4 sp.def / atk
    Hone Claws
    Earthquake
    Rock Polish
    Ice Fang / Stone Edge

    Meant as a defensive Pokémon that turns to the offensive pool it has access to, hone claws makes gliscor more menacing cause it gets more attack and needed accuracy for stone edge or even ice Fang, earthquake is a great stab and stone edge helps with the coverage it would normally miss while rock polish makes it a monster in speed after +4

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    Gliscor@Toxic Orb
    Nature: Impish
    Ability: Poision Heal
    EVs: 252 HP / 72 Spd / 184 Defense
    -Earthquake
    -Ice Fang
    -Swords Dance
    -Protect

    Fairly standard set. Earthquake is your general go to move, hitting for decent damage. Defenses allow you to shut down powerful physical attackers such as Terrankion. Ice Fang hits dragons and Landorus-T for good damage on the switch. Swords Dance allows for boosting attack to excellent levels, while protect is fairly standard to stall for recovery.
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    10 posts and no flying gem set? Strange.

    Gliscor
    Item : Flying Gem
    Ability : Hyper Cutter
    Nature : Adamant(+Att, -Sp Att)
    EVs : 4 HP, 252 Att, 252 Spd

    Moveset:
    -Earthquake
    -Acrobatics
    -Swords Dance
    -Substitute

    This set is probably the best offensive set for Gliscor. First of all why Acrobatics and not something like Aerial Ace? that's because this move becomes twice as powerful when the user is not holding an item. When Gliscor uses Acrobatics the first time in the battle it loses the Flying Gem for the sake of +1 and since it is no longer having an item on itself the power of Acrobatics also increase making it +2. Add STAB to it and you get a insanely powerful move that will hurt anything and everything. Earthquake is for the obvious STAB, rest of the moveset is also pretty obvious.
    Coming on to the EV spread. I gave it 252 in both Att and Speed cause it needs maxed out attacks and speed so that it can hit hard and fast. 4 in HP can be reallocated to some other stat if needed.
    Hyper Cutter makes sure there is no Att drop in case an Intimidate Pokemon switches in. Very important since Gliscor is going all out attack.

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    To be honest, Umbilical Noose, I'm more surprised nobody else has considered Façade as an option with Poison Heal...
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kraleck View Post
    To be honest, Umbilical Noose, I'm more surprised nobody else has considered Façade as an option with Poison Heal...
    Facade ehhh? Intriguing. But personally, the lower tier pokemon holding the Guts ability, swellow or Ursaring, are better Facade Abusers in my book. I mean, it's nice to have. Jellicent could be troublesome if your gliscor only has facade as it's only attack.

    Anyways, I personally see a reuniclus having a good role in countering Gliscor since it has special attacks, pretty bulky, and gets NO damage from toxic thanks to Magic Guard
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kraleck View Post
    To be honest, Umbilical Noose, I'm more surprised nobody else has considered Façade as an option with Poison Heal...
    I've seen it before with the SD Poison Heal set, but generally Ice Fang is better for taking out things immune to EQ (Like Dragons and opposing Gliscor). SD + 3 attacks Poison Heal with EQ/Ice Fang/Facade/SD could be pretty interesting to see in action.

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    Gliscor
    If it succeeds in catching even a faint breeze properly, it can circle the globe without flapping once.

    Gliscor @ Toxic Orb
    Impish - Poison Heal
    244 HP / 248 Def / 16 Spe
    ~Earthquake
    ~Taunt / Toxic
    ~Ice Fang / U-turn
    ~Roost / Protect

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    Ah, Gliscor. I remember wishing that Gliscor's line was exclusive to Soulsilver instead of Heartgold. That was back when I only judged Pokemon based on their appearance. I don't know any sets for Gliscor, but it's a neat Pokemon.
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    We all know Gliscor is amazing. It has huge physical bulk, a great type for defense, an excellent ability, and a usable attack stat. Gliscor is one of the most conventional counters to the deadly Terrakion and other fighting types not packing Ice Punch. So, instead of providing movesets, I'm going to give you some of Gliscor's less conventional options and counters.

    Other Options (hypothetically):
    Since Poison Heal will be used often, Facade can be considered. However, Facade is something Gliscor will not have enough room for.
    Sky Uppercut is cool, but redundant.
    Struggle Bug can help give Gliscor some special bulk. Sort of. Like Facade, Struggle Bug doesn't fit. Struggle Bug is also impractical.
    Protect can give a 100% chance of Toxic Orb's activation.
    As long as you are not using Poison Heal, Baton Pass is a fantastic option. Gliscor has wonderful Baton Pass options:
    Swords Dance
    Agility/Rock Polish
    Hone Claws
    Substitute

    Countering:
    Ice. That's all you need to know.
    Okay, no not really. Starmie is a great option. Starmie can take an Earthquake and U-Turn, Rapid Spin the Stealth Rock that Gliscor will be dropping, and chill it with Ice Beam or Hydro Pump. While not the best solution, Donphan can also switch into anything Gliscor can throw, Rapid Spin Stealth Rocks, and bring it down (relatively slowly) with Ice Shard. Gastrodon can shrug off Stealth Rock and any attack Gliscor has with relative ease and launch Ice Beams or Scalds. Scald can double as a Burn inducer if a) you are lucky and b) Gliscor doesn't use Protect for instant self poison. If Gliscor is not using an Acrobatics set, Conkeldurr can freely Bulk Up and Ice Punch away.
    Okay, so a less straight-forward tactic might be better. Ferrothorn can stall out Gliscor with Leech Seed and Gyro Ball/Power Whip. Dragon Tail is another option when combined with Stealth Rock.
    What makes Gliscor such a powerful defensive threat is that it uses sets that can basically become Stealth Rock, Roost, Earthquake, and U-Turn. It's a set-up and strike strategy that happens quickly, so Gliscor will rarely run into problems with Taunt abusers.

    Beating Gliscor is a heavy task, but not an impossible one. Make sure you have something with a strong Ice Beam. If you don't, then I will have to wonder how you plan to succeed.
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    Hyper Cutter w/ Life Orb/Leftovers OR Poison Heal w/ Toxic Orb
    Adamant w/ 252 Attack, 130 Defense, 128 Speed
    Earthquake
    Fire Fang/Night Slash
    Stone Edge/Brick Break/Smack Down
    Thunder Fang

    Countering-OU
    High Defense and Sp Attack with Ice/Water-type attacks like Glaceon, Wash/Frost Rotom, or Ice Beam Starmie/Gorebyss/Evolite Porygon2/Kingdra.
    Last edited by sbktdreed; 25th August 2013 at 6:39 AM.
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    Gliscor's main issues, aside from a quad-Weakness to Ice, is that its Physical bulk does little to help its Sp.Def stat and that it has 2 common Types as its Weaknesses. Faster Pokémon with access to good Sp.Atk and Hidden Power (Ice) or Ice Beam (or the rare Technician Persian with Icy Wind) can be a hassle to tank. If Gliscor dares set wing in their territory, Mismagius, Gengar, Azelf, Cryogonal, and the extremely lucky Hydreigon will wreck it with Earthquake immunity (from Levitate), neutrality or better (for the non-Hydreigon Pokémon) to Ice Fang, and high Sp.Atk.

    Another issue: Gliscor's Movepool. Sure it's got a lot of great Moves and Types, but consider this - it has a LOT of great Moves and Types. Choosing a Moveset is tricky because you not only have to play the bluff of a particular set, but also back up that big talk and not tip your hand. If you let them know too early, the opponent can adjust their strategy and flip the table over on top of you.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kraleck View Post
    Another issue: Gliscor's Movepool. Sure it's got a lot of great Moves and Types, but consider this - it has a LOT of great Moves and Types. Choosing a Moveset is tricky because you not only have to play the bluff of a particular set, but also back up that big talk and not tip your hand. If you let them know too early, the opponent can adjust their strategy and flip the table over on top of you.
    Also, most of those moves have a low BP, so unless you're running SD or getting a x4 effectiveness, they won't be doing much damage.

  22. #22

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    There's not too much to say about Gliscor that hasn't already been said. I would like to encourage people to remember to run plenty of speed on their SubToxic Gliscor sets, though. One of the true strengths about that set is its ability to get past some of its usual checks and counters through the use of Substitute + Protect + Toxic, namely Pokemon like Rotom-W, and all to often I see many people who fail to get by these threats since they've neglected speed with outdated EV spreads. The Smogon analysis suggests 224 EVs with a neutral nature to outrun Adamant Landorus-T and everything slower, and I honestly think this is a good benchmark to shoot for. This might still leave you vulnerable to HP Ice from a Naive Landorus-t, Timid Rotom-W, etc., but the extra speed investment can put a dent in your physical bulk. For example, with the 244 HP / 40 Def / 224 Spe Impish spread, Gliscor can switch into CB Terrakion's Stone Edge with Stealth Rock down, use Protect to stall for more recovery, and survive the second hit ~72% of the time. It's obviously not as good at taking those hits as a more physically defensive spread, but it does well enough. However, in order to outspeed Naive/Jolly Landorus-T and everything slower, you'll need an identical EV spread with a Jolly nature. In this case, you only have ~3% chance to survive that same encounter with CB Terrakion. I don't think this is necessarily worth it, especially since I honestly don't see many +Spe Landorus-T or Rotom-W that aren't Scarfed or otherwise boosted, but it's always an option.

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