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Thread: General Characters/Storyline Thread

  1. #351
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    I agreed with majority of people saying that story was lacking a lot. I like team flare story but the rivals and gym leader/champion wasn't doing it for me. Gym leaders did nothing compare to bw leader, the champion was boring and rival got credit for doing nothing also. I haven't did looker task which I am planning to do soon.
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  2. #352
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    Quote Originally Posted by dirkac View Post
    Still, simply because he pities one girl does not mean that his actions of the machine are wiped from existance.
    Did I say that?
    He committed his sins and it's obvious that they won't just disapppear.
    Man, this side-quest was really dark if we're discussing so animously. LOL
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  3. #353
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    Quote Originally Posted by CrusherTheFeraligatr View Post
    Anybody else digging the archer hate?
    I can't even think of who Archer is at the moment.

    OK I just looked him up and he's the guy from HG/SS. He's so forgettable that I just finished a HG playthrough a few weeks ago and don't even remember him lol.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aetius View Post
    Did I say that?
    He committed his sins and it's obvious that they won't just disapppear.
    Man, this side-quest was really dark if we're discussing so animously. LOL
    No, you didn't say that.

    You did say that he does have some good in him, which I agree at a bit, but simply because of some good (which literally every character in Pokémon has shown to some degree, excluding people that had no characer anyway), it doesn't do anything to his character to all the rest that happened.

    Quote Originally Posted by ebevan91 View Post
    I can't even think of who Archer is at the moment.


    OK I just looked him up and he's the guy from HG/SS. He's so forgettable that I just finished a HG playthrough a few weeks ago and don't even remember him lol.
    One of the Rocket Executives, although he doesn't even have anhing going for him other than battle.

  5. #355
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    Then if you put it like that our opinion is the same.
    He's got some good in him, but he must pay for all the bad things he did.
    Guess it can be resumed like this the whole story, even though it's a bit simple to put it this way.
    Anyway do you want Emma to make a return? I do because I think she's an adorable character.
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  6. #356
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    Quote Originally Posted by Endolise View Post
    I wasn't disappointed by the story. I would say that it was about on par with Platinum's story which is pretty good for a Pokémon game. Certainly a step back from the magnificence that was BW/B2W2's story (and while those still remain my favorite games, I would rank XY right behind them), but that's not necessarily a bad thing since, as I said, XY's story was on the same level as Platinum's which I already thought was great.

    I do wish that the Gym Leaders could have been more characterized and that Diantha would have made more appearances, but who knows? Maybe that would have made things too cluttered. The games are already fairly long as it is.

    Team Flare's plot was great. I really enjoyed it, and Lysandre has now outranked Cyrus as my third favorite villain. I also thought that AZ was given a sufficient amount of appearances and never felt that he needed more. He serves the purpose that I think GF wanted him to.

    Obviously, being as obsessed with Pokémon mythology as I am, I would have liked for Xerneas/Yveltal to have been given more backstory (what they have now basically amounts to Lugia/Ho-Oh-level mythology, which isn't all too spectacular), but I guess I'll live. Xerneas and Yveltal are pretty cool on their own anyway. Although I am assuming that there will be more in the next games, as Zygarde still has to be explained.


    Also Tierno was totally useless
    Platinum however was a little step further from RSE who started the whole idea of Teams having essentially good intentions (even if their actions were completely wrong) by exploiting more the figure of their leader, making the confrontation as climatic as possible and even giving a bit of backstory to the antagonist. Perhaps it wasn't that great, but it was trying to go further than before. THe complain about the story here is not that it's bad per se, rather than it went back a bit especially given it had everything to be as good as BW.

    I think AZ needed more appearances given how the plot pretty much begins with his actions, the message of the game about sharing and living is also related to him heavily. He made the waepon, he experienced the war, he interacted with the Legendary, he is Team Flare's objective, Lyssandre is apparently his descendant, he even is related to the whole idea of human foolishness, waste and loss that the game tackles as its message. Even the theme song at the end is about all that, but the whole theme the game is supposed to be about wasn't dropped unless Lyssandre ranted about it or the credits song. It's a nice message, so why instead of the thing we all know: "pokemon are your friends, bond with them" take that other message and put it around? That's why I feel things had unused potential.

    I don't think the game was long because there were many events, more than many parts were too full of padding. Having more characters interact with you, if done carefully should not bother with anything, on the opposite it would make things more interesting. Though if not, it can backfire and as you say clutter things. Though all this is just story wise, gameplay wise the game is excellent.

    Yeah, Tierno, Shauna and Trevor actually don't do that much. Which could also have been handled better in their developments. At least Shauna tries though, and the fireworks scene is, in my opinion, actually kind of sweet.

  7. #357
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aetius View Post
    Anyway what you liked more about the Looker bureau's side-quest?
    I know that I really liked Looker's noir-esque "windowshade" monologues. :P

    Quote Originally Posted by Daisymareep View Post
    rival got credit for doing nothing also
    You mean besides helping you infiltrate Team Flare's HQ every step of the way?
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  8. #358
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    Quote Originally Posted by Endolise View Post
    I know that I really liked Looker's noir-esque "windowshade" monologues. :P
    Oh, yeah, his monologues were funny. XD
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  9. #359
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    Quote Originally Posted by Endolise View Post
    I know that I really liked Looker's noir-esque "windowshade" monologues. :P



    You mean besides helping you infiltrate Team Flare's HQ every step of the way?
    My bad. I didn't mean to said Calem/Serena but the other three which didn't do that much compare to Calem but was rewarded as defenders. I keeping calling them all rivals.
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  10. #360
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    Personally, while I do agree that XY's story was more along the lines of Platinum, I feel that the latter did more with its story and characters then XY did. With Platinum, they started to flesh out their NPC characters and you had Gym Leaders that had more traits to them, showed up outside of the gym for their activities and were more active in their community. Of course, they're not as involved as their BW counterparts, but they were the building blocks for those Gym Leaders, so I felt that XY going back even further then that level of character bothered me quite a bit. Same with the rivals and the Elite Four to a lesser extent. For the former they're given pretty interesting goals, but they don't go anywhere with them outside of Calem/Serena and the Elite Four aside from Malva don't have that much story or character to them either, and the champion is a step back from all the other champions in terms of character and involvement.

    I feel where this hits the game the most was in the Team Flare plot. With the Platinum Admins, they showed some character in how they responded to Cyrus and his goals. Mars and Jupiter were loyal to him, Saturn was aghast when he found out his true plan and Charon used him. The scientists in contrast are rather generic and don't really have much character to them outside of specific traits, and that makes them very easy to overlook. Also, we do see Cyrus directly talk to the grunts and have both tell us how they feel about each other whereas Lysandre doesn't get the chance to really bounce off of any of the other Team Flare members and they themselves don't really get much into the goal or Lysandre. Galactic also did more with their plot then Team Flare did with theirs as they had more incidents in the game that gradually made them more of the threat, Team Flare's plot had a few, but ultimately most were too secluded and the big endgame was pretty restricted and rushed.

    Having said that, Lysandre and AZ are the best part of the plot, the story does a decent job of addressing their goals and in the latter case, his regret, so we do get that sense of character from them. I do feel that they missed some opportunities to really go into their story and characters and more directly address them through character interactions showing their growth or how they reached their conclusion and X and Y kind of glance over that. Same with the legendaries, they don't go anywhere with their backstories and as Endolise said it best, it's closer to Lugia/Ho-oh then the more expanded storylines of the recent generations. So it's very disappointing that they overlook the chance to really flesh these guys out.

    Overall, I'd say XY are games with great opportunities that just missed the mark because they don't go as much in depth with them as they could. If they fleshed out these characters, I think it'd easily match BW IMO but it just doesn't go as far as those games or Platinum did in that area so it's held back by that restriction. That is, for the main plot, the Looker sidequest on the other hand does a great job of handling its characters and plot and is easily my favorite part of the game story-wise.
    Last edited by Taodragon; 28th October 2013 at 9:10 PM.


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  11. #361
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    I watched the fireworks with Shauna yesterday at Parfum Palace and I think I'm starting to like her. I thought she was overrated before but she seems nice enough. I'm still pressed about her, Tierno, and Trevor popping up everywhere I go though. It's like they're stalking me haha. At least when Serena shows up it's to give me useful information.

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    I feel like this game should've been called "Looker X & Y" just for how he got more development than your uninteresting Kalosian friends.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ebevan91 View Post
    I can't even think of who Archer is at the moment.

    OK I just looked him up and he's the guy from HG/SS. He's so forgettable that I just finished a HG playthrough a few weeks ago and don't even remember him lol.
    I don't even think of that one having a 'boss'.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Underachiever007 View Post
    Nope. I wouldn't be surprised to see numerous Yuri fan manga about her and Shauna to hit the Internet in a couple of months though.
    Hilarious you say that, because my sister and I joke about Shauna whenever she interacts with the female character: she exudes almost the same attitude as she would to a boy, I feel. All cheerleader-like and "I'll always remember this..." during the fireworks. Compared to the others, I actually liked her and Calem's character, but I'm just sayin'... She wanted the d ~oooor~ v, ahaha.
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  15. #365
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    When it comes to Shauna, I think she was seriously overrated. The fireworks scene felt very cheesy and forced to me. Trevor was annoying, stiff and basically without a personality. The only one I liked was Tierno, he was funny and somehow I found him the most relatable even given the fact I don't like to dance myself.

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  16. #366
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    Quote Originally Posted by Taodragon View Post
    I feel where this hits the game the most was in the Team Flare plot. With the Platinum Admins, they showed some character in how they responded to Cyrus and his goals. Mars and Jupiter were loyal to him, Saturn was aghast when he found out his true plan and Charon used him. The scientists in contrast are rather generic and don't really have much character to them outside of specific traits, and that makes them very easy to overlook. Also, we do see Cyrus directly talk to the grunts and have both tell us how they feel about each other whereas Lysandre doesn't get the chance to really bounce off of any of the other Team Flare members and they themselves don't really get much into the goal or Lysandre. Galactic also did more with their plot then Team Flare did with theirs as they had more incidents in the game that gradually made them more of the threat, Team Flare's plot had a few, but ultimately most were too secluded and the big endgame was pretty restricted and rushed.
    Exactly this. You pretty much put my thoughts into words.

    I found most of the non-Lysandre Team Flare encounters to be really forced. Few of them had any actual relevance to their plan, and the ones that did were just vague "lets collect energy" plots. The four female scientists were carbon copies of each other and didn't feel very imposing at all, compared to Galactic's admins (who I actually really enjoyed). Xerosic at least had some characterisation, but he only had a last minute appearance and really didn't add very much. I really wish Team Flare had been a more interesting team as a whole because Lysandre was a wonderful boss.

    Quote Originally Posted by vedil View Post
    When it comes to Shauna, I think she was seriously overrated. The fireworks scene felt very cheesy and forced to me. Trevor was annoying, stiff and basically without a personality. The only one I liked was Tierno, he was funny and somehow I found him the most relatable even given the fact I don't like to dance myself.
    Eh, I didn't really mind the fireworks scene, it was short and didn't really have much impact. Also, Tierno was probably my least favourite of the group. His whole dance thing seemed incredibly tacked on to me and I think he was pretty pointless over all.

  17. #367
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    Quote Originally Posted by Taodragon View Post
    Personally, while I do agree that XY's story was more along the lines of Platinum, I feel that the latter did more with its story and characters then XY did. With Platinum, they started to flesh out their NPC characters and you had Gym Leaders that had more traits to them, showed up outside of the gym for their activities and were more active in their community. Of course, they're not as involved as their BW counterparts, but they were the building blocks for those Gym Leaders, so I felt that XY going back even further then that level of character bothered me quite a bit. Same with the rivals and the Elite Four to a lesser extent. For the former they're given pretty interesting goals, but they don't go anywhere with them outside of Calem/Serena and the Elite Four aside from Malva don't have that much story or character to them either, and the champion is a step back from all the other champions in terms of character and involvement.

    I feel where this hits the game the most was in the Team Flare plot. With the Platinum Admins, they showed some character in how they responded to Cyrus and his goals. Mars and Jupiter were loyal to him, Saturn was aghast when he found out his true plan and Charon used him. The scientists in contrast are rather generic and don't really have much character to them outside of specific traits, and that makes them very easy to overlook. Also, we do see Cyrus directly talk to the grunts and have both tell us how they feel about each other whereas Lysandre doesn't get the chance to really bounce off of any of the other Team Flare members and they themselves don't really get much into the goal or Lysandre. Galactic also did more with their plot then Team Flare did with theirs as they had more incidents in the game that gradually made them more of the threat, Team Flare's plot had a few, but ultimately most were too secluded and the big endgame was pretty restricted and rushed.

    Having said that, Lysandre and AZ are the best part of the plot, the story does a decent job of addressing their goals and in the latter case, his regret, so we do get that sense of character from them. I do feel that they missed some opportunities to really go into their story and characters and more directly address them through character interactions showing their growth or how they reached their conclusion and X and Y kind of glance over that. Same with the legendaries, they don't go anywhere with their backstories and as Endolise said it best, it's closer to Lugia/Ho-oh then the more expanded storylines of the recent generations. So it's very disappointing that they overlook the chance to really flesh these guys out.

    Overall, I'd say XY are games with great opportunities that just missed the mark because they don't go as much in depth with them as they could. If they fleshed out these characters, I think it'd easily match BW IMO but it just doesn't go as far as those games or Platinum did in that area so it's held back by that restriction. That is, for the main plot, the Looker sidequest on the other hand does a great job of handling its characters and plot and is easily my favorite part of the game story-wise.
    Agree completely.

    Onto another thing:

    Shauna overrated? I haven't looked around much, but I haven't really heard anybody praising her. Actually the opposite, telling how weak and underdeveloped her character was like Trevor and Tierno.

  18. #368

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    The fireworks scene made much less sense to me when it was taking place during the day...

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  19. #369
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    So can someone remind me if it was implied Sina and Dexio already completed the pokedex? I remember Dexio talking about how he worked on it but that's all I can remember.
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  20. #370
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    I really loved the Looker postgame story, and this is coming from someone who despised the Looker stories in past games. I saw the theme of bonds there above anywhere else.
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    I found it weaker than BW at first, but in the end I came to like this story. It seems things start off very simplistically, but I look back and notice that all the really heavy background details that surfaced later on were placed in the earlier game with subtlety. It was such a massive shock to have that unveiled to me, and I thought it was really cool.

    In terms of the antagonists and major conflict, I think that Lysander is what really made Team Flare all on his own. I mean of course I know that literally, but I also mean in another sense :S He was only guy there that I could really feel anything for. The origins/reasons behind his plan, and the feelings that he had along with that were understandable (to an extent). The admins and grunts...They...Really just felt like very typical obstacles.

    Contrast to Team Plasma folks, where you have this big group of people flocking to their "King/Hero/Savior" because they genuinely believe in what he's saying. Or the few grunts who began to really question their ways at certain points in the story. Or the concern felt from N's caretakers. They generally felt like people and not just the typical bad guys.

    Likewise, Lysander had a real point to what he was saying (but not doing...), just like N did.
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  22. #372
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    Is it bad of me to say that the Looker chapters had a better story than the main?

    I'm not saying the main story's plot was bad because it wasn't, but it wasn't good either.
    Team Flare for 75% of the game came of unorganized, and confusing. By the time you reach the Team Flare climax you have to sit down and think to yourself... Well that certainly came out of left field... I'm not kidding no spoilers or anything but that solution Lysandere had made no sense.
    I understand where Team Flare was getting at with changing the world, but they (more so Lysandere) went about it the wrong way.

    I guess it doesn't matter much because XY's strong point isn't the story (at all) but the revamped multiplayer that came with it.
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheBattleFrontierAsh1 View Post
    Is it bad of me to say that the Looker chapters had a better story than the main?
    No, a lot of people would agree with you.

    Quote Originally Posted by TheBattleFrontierAsh1 View Post
    I'm not kidding no spoilers or anything but that solution Lysandere had made no sense.
    How so? It was extreme, yes, but it was a logical solution from a mathematical perspective.

    Quote Originally Posted by TheBattleFrontierAsh1 View Post
    I understand where Team Flare was getting at with changing the world, but they (more so Lysandere) went about it the wrong way.
    Isn't that pretty much always the case with criminal organizations in Pokémon?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Charmed View Post
    I watched the fireworks with Shauna yesterday at Parfum Palace and I think I'm starting to like her. I thought she was overrated before but she seems nice enough. I'm still pressed about her, Tierno, and Trevor popping up everywhere I go though. It's like they're stalking me haha. At least when Serena shows up it's to give me useful information.
    I just past this part of the story too and I actually find Shauna more annoying than the rest of the bunch. As far as the fat kid is concern, he is pretty much ignored. Calem and the nerd are the only ones I can seem to stand in this game.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Endolise View Post
    No, a lot of people would agree with you.



    How so? It was extreme, yes, but it was a logical solution from a mathematical perspective.



    Isn't that pretty much always the case with criminal organizations in Pokémon?
    I think the problem is not that the solution is too extreme, rather how you could deduce how previous teams from RSE onwards by their actions how they were reaching their goals. And here Lyssandre just pops up in the Holo Caster: "Good morning. Just wanted to let you I am killing everybody not in my team. Have a nice day."

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