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Thread: Gym Leaders & Elite Four Thread

  1. #926
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nightshade Aran View Post
    Theres 4 ppl that use Mega Evolutions though. Korrina, Lysandre, Diantha and Serena/Calem. Pretty sure they said that the M-Evo rings were quite rare.
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  2. #927
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    Quote Originally Posted by KantoPkmnMaster View Post
    I don't think it would be too outlandish to consider the E4 to have mega-evolutions. After all, in the anime special, i believe Siebold has a mega evolution. Malva, because of her association with team flare could believably have one, and the other two could easily have one too, just because they're the elite 4.
    Oh I'm not saying it's outlandish to consider that, you're probably right. I'm just saying they probably want to stay consistent with the rarity of them. Also, wouldn't consider what happens on the anime to play any relevance in the games. How many times have we beaten the Elite 4 and Champion, vs how many times useless-Ash done anything productive?
    Dunno, I just wouldn't compare game to anime, or pay it too much attention that way, since so many things are different from one to the other.
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  3. #928
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nightshade Aran View Post
    Viola only has 2 Bug/Flying when she's in the Battle Chateau though, when she's just a Gym Leader through regular play she has Bug/Water and Bug/Flying, which in fact brings diversity. So I wouldn't technically count that.
    Speaking of the Battle Chateau, it was extremely disappointing that in the Battle Chateau rematches the Gym Leaders and Elite 4 have LESS Pokemon than they did during your first battle. Does Game Freak not understand that people want to fight against full teams?
    Quote Originally Posted by LizardonX View Post
    Tabitha has really let himself go, just how many lava cookies did he eat in the last 11 years?

  4. #929
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bolt the Cat View Post
    Speaking of the Battle Chateau, it was extremely disappointing that in the Battle Chateau rematches the Gym Leaders and Elite 4 have LESS Pokemon than they did during your first battle. Does Game Freak not understand that people want to fight against full teams?
    Yeah... tell me about it. There wasn't a single fight where I thought, oh man, I might lose! at any point during the game. (Battle Maison aside, because sometimes they freaking cheat).

    Saying this, and not because I'm an old school fanboy, but honestly, in previous games, there were plenty of times in gyms/elite4 and particularly vs the champion, or vs Red wherever he was hidden where I'd just get steamrolled unless I severely prepared. This is something I really miss from previous games. That fight vs Red, and serious post-game fights vs other powerful trainers.
    Now, it's like, oh you're the champion? well go spend 500k in Highrollers Sushi. Oh the champion? well, that's nice...?

    I can't help but to think of Cynthia in cases like this, she was a freaking monster trainer, a true champion, pre-defeating her as a champion and post game when you could challenge her.
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  5. #930
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nightshade Aran View Post
    Yeah... tell me about it. There wasn't a single fight where I thought, oh man, I might lose! at any point during the game. (Battle Maison aside, because sometimes they freaking cheat).

    Saying this, and not because I'm an old school fanboy, but honestly, in previous games, there were plenty of times in gyms/elite4 and particularly vs the champion, or vs Red wherever he was hidden where I'd just get steamrolled unless I severely prepared. This is something I really miss from previous games. That fight vs Red, and serious post-game fights vs other powerful trainers.
    Now, it's like, oh you're the champion? well go spend 500k in Highrollers Sushi. Oh the champion? well, that's nice...?

    I can't help but to think of Cynthia in cases like this, she was a freaking monster trainer, a true champion, pre-defeating her as a champion and post game when you could challenge her.
    They do cheat in the Battle Maison! xD But, hey, I already thought of that about the Battle Tower back in Gen 3. I clearly remember having made it to trainer 99 (!) once and having then faced someone with the 3 Gen 3 Regis. They all used explosion... after they slowly mowed over my Pokemon. And despite the tie, I lost. -.- (luckily, and with much perseverance, I triumphed at a later try, but gosh was I enraged)

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    Quote Originally Posted by cryuel View Post
    They do cheat in the Battle Maison! xD But, hey, I already thought of that about the Battle Tower back in Gen 3. I clearly remember having made it to trainer 99 (!) once and having then faced someone with the 3 Gen 3 Regis. They all used explosion... after they slowly mowed over my Pokemon. And despite the tie, I lost. -.- (luckily, and with much perseverance, I triumphed at a later try, but gosh was I enraged)
    It's a regi to whom I owe that comment to... Registeel flinched me 100% of the time with Iron Head, caused me to lose at 47 streak in super rotations... not a happy camper to lose so close to that trophy.
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  7. #932
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nightshade Aran View Post
    It's a regi to whom I owe that comment to... Registeel flinched me 100% of the time with Iron Head, caused me to lose at 47 streak in super rotations... not a happy camper to lose so close to that trophy.
    I know it's likely just conspiracy theory and all, but the game totally knows and cheats! xD

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    Quote Originally Posted by cryuel View Post
    I know it's likely just conspiracy theory and all, but the game totally knows and cheats! xD
    It's not like it's any different from past generations competitive areas. The game analyzes the weaknesses of your team and capitalizes on them. It's not like you don't have advantages though or ways to tip the scales in your favor. Get a mega-evolution pokemon, good hidden ability pokemon and you can mess with the AI easily. My personal favorite way of messing with the AI in the Battle Chateau is Protean Greninja w/ Mat Block + Lv. 1 Sturdy Aron w/ Berry Juice. AI is so dumb it constantly goes for Aron and allows for easy setups. But aside from this, i think we're getting a little off-topic, so i feel the need to put us back on topic. Anyways, if you could remove one gym which would you remove and why?

    If i had to choose a gym out of all the ones this generation, i'd probably get rid of Santalune Gym (Bug). It just felt underwhelming, even for the initial gym. This is probably due in my opinion to the lack of bug pokemon this generation. I really felt like this generation would've been a great generation to introduce the first Dark Type gym. Basically, i would've reorganized the league to where every gym would've moved down a spot in order, with the Dark Type gym rounding out the final spot. As for what pokemon would be used, i figured a 3 pokemon final leader was acceptable, with a somewhat challenging team composed of 3 pokemon: Greninja, Malamar, Pangoro. Thoughts?

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    Quote Originally Posted by KantoPkmnMaster View Post
    It's not like it's any different from past generations competitive areas. The game analyzes the weaknesses of your team and capitalizes on them. It's not like you don't have advantages though or ways to tip the scales in your favor. Get a mega-evolution pokemon, good hidden ability pokemon and you can mess with the AI easily. My personal favorite way of messing with the AI in the Battle Chateau is Protean Greninja w/ Mat Block + Lv. 1 Sturdy Aron w/ Berry Juice. AI is so dumb it constantly goes for Aron and allows for easy setups. But aside from this, i think we're getting a little off-topic, so i feel the need to put us back on topic. Anyways, if you could remove one gym which would you remove and why?

    If i had to choose a gym out of all the ones this generation, i'd probably get rid of Santalune Gym (Bug). It just felt underwhelming, even for the initial gym. This is probably due in my opinion to the lack of bug pokemon this generation. I really felt like this generation would've been a great generation to introduce the first Dark Type gym. Basically, i would've reorganized the league to where every gym would've moved down a spot in order, with the Dark Type gym rounding out the final spot. As for what pokemon would be used, i figured a 3 pokemon final leader was acceptable, with a somewhat challenging team composed of 3 pokemon: Greninja, Malamar, Pangoro. Thoughts?
    Point 1) Could you pm me info on that Greninja w/Mat Block + Lv. 1 Sturdy Aron? I'd very much like to attempt some trophy runs and I've seen that a lot but don't quite get it.

    Point 2) That sounds like a pretty good idea, having them rotation off like that, what were Elite 4 before, are gyms now, etc. As for what I'd have them use in a Dark gym, Greninja, Malamar and Houndoom. They usually always use a combination of both new and old pokemon, in this case they could even add a mega evolution per gym as well. (Or at least in future games)

    As to what gym I'd remove this gen... electric probably, except in Johto it's gotten represented as a gym in every other generation.
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  10. #935
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    I think if they were to do a Dark type gym in Kalos, it would probably be something like Absol, Weavile, and Pangoro.
    Quote Originally Posted by LizardonX View Post
    Tabitha has really let himself go, just how many lava cookies did he eat in the last 11 years?

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    My biggest dissappointment with gen 6 was the lack of difficulty overall. When I beat the gym leaders, champion or the elite 4, I want to feel a sense of accomplishment. I didn't feel that at all this time. Cynthia was by far the toughest (and coolest imo) champion. The HGSS pokemon league was tough too...I hope the future games bring back that challenge.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sh4d0wF0rc3 View Post
    My biggest dissappointment with gen 6 was the lack of difficulty overall. When I beat the gym leaders, champion or the elite 4, I want to feel a sense of accomplishment. I didn't feel that at all this time. Cynthia was by far the toughest (and coolest imo) champion. The HGSS pokemon league was tough too...I hope the future games bring back that challenge.
    And you did in 5th gen? Most people that complain about the difficulty usually think that 5th gen is what started this.
    Quote Originally Posted by LizardonX View Post
    Tabitha has really let himself go, just how many lava cookies did he eat in the last 11 years?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bolt the Cat View Post
    And you did in 5th gen? Most people that complain about the difficulty usually think that 5th gen is what started this.
    Maybe, but at least in gen 5 the Elite 4 got full teams of six and a boost in levels for subsequent challenges.
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    Am I the only one who thinks the elite four and champion should have Pokemon at levels between 90 and 100? I know that sounds too tough, but the elite four and champion just don't feel so "elite" when they don't battle with the highest leveled Pokemon plus you have Exp. Share so leveling up won't be so tedious.

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    Am I the only one who thinks the elite four and champion should have Pokemon at levels between 90 and 100? I know that sounds too tough, but the elite four and champion just don't feel so "elite" when they don't battle with the highest leveled Pokemon plus you have Exp. Share so leveling up won't be so tedious.
    yes... because you need to remember Pokemon is primary aimed at KIDS! I heard that even with experience share there were some kids who are having a trouble.


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    Quote Originally Posted by PokeBash View Post
    Am I the only one who thinks the elite four and champion should have Pokemon at levels between 90 and 100? I know that sounds too tough, but the elite four and champion just don't feel so "elite" when they don't battle with the highest leveled Pokemon plus you have Exp. Share so leveling up won't be so tedious.
    That would've made completing the main storyline too hard imo. The Elite Four's Pokemon's levels were fine the way they were in my opinion.

  17. #942
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    Quote Originally Posted by PokeBash View Post
    Am I the only one who thinks the elite four and champion should have Pokemon at levels between 90 and 100? I know that sounds too tough, but the elite four and champion just don't feel so "elite" when they don't battle with the highest leveled Pokemon plus you have Exp. Share so leveling up won't be so tedious.
    I say just make them smarter, and a little higher in levels. maybe 60-70.
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    Quote Originally Posted by PokeBash View Post
    Am I the only one who thinks the elite four and champion should have Pokemon at levels between 90 and 100? I know that sounds too tough, but the elite four and champion just don't feel so "elite" when they don't battle with the highest leveled Pokemon plus you have Exp. Share so leveling up won't be so tedious.
    I think that their levels should increase the more you battle them. Start with them being between levels 55-60, then after a certain number of wins they go up to 65-70 and later 75-80, but probably stop there.
    And they should get full teams of six, if not initially then at least for rematches.

    My main problem with Elite Four is that they are just like Gym Leaders, relying on a pokemon of one type. These are meant to be the best of the best, and I can take out their teams by repeatedly using one move.
    I mean, come on! Dresna is one of the greatest trainers, yet I send in Lapras and four Ice Beams later and its all over. Hardly a struggle for someone who had paid attention for all of the rest of the game.
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    Quote Originally Posted by PokeBash View Post
    Am I the only one who thinks the elite four and champion should have Pokemon at levels between 90 and 100? I know that sounds too tough, but the elite four and champion just don't feel so "elite" when they don't battle with the highest leveled Pokemon plus you have Exp. Share so leveling up won't be so tedious.
    That seems a little too high right off the bat for your first challenge against them. Just have them get stronger the more you battle them. It was disappointing that they stayed at those levels no matter how many times you battled them.

    I agree that the E4 should not just specialize in one type. Have them be like Cynthia and Alder (any other champions I'm missing who did this?) where they have a variety of different types on their team.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Painkiller2001 View Post
    That seems a little too high right off the bat for your first challenge against them. Just have them get stronger the more you battle them. It was disappointing that they stayed at those levels no matter how many times you battled them.

    I agree that the E4 should not just specialize in one type. Have them be like Cynthia and Alder (any other champions I'm missing who did this?) where they have a variety of different types on their team.
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  21. #946
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nightshade Aran View Post
    Diantha, Lance, Blue as well.
    That's right. How could I forget them?
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    I was really disappointed when challenging the E4 of Kalos. First of all the fact they all only got 4 pokemon each instead of 5 in previous generations. I also don't like the fact that you can choose the order in which you try to take them on. I'd rather see the old way of predeterminated order return (really hope they do so in OR/AS). At last the overall difficulty of the E4 and champion Diantha was just to low. I beat them in my very first try, without heavy training beforehand and I think many can relate to that. I think they can fix that by increasing the levels of the E4 pokemon and making them smarter, or make it harder to level up your own pokemon (old system of the exp. share). But than again I really like the new exp.share because of post game reasons.

    Quote Originally Posted by Painkiller2001 View Post
    I agree that the E4 should not just specialize in one type. Have them be like Cynthia and Alder (any other champions I'm missing who did this?) where they have a variety of different types on their team.
    I think the E4 should specialize in one type. That's what makes them different from each other. The champion however should use a variety of types, but in most generations that's already the case.


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  23. #948
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    Quote Originally Posted by Typhlosion_Hunter_Mark View Post
    I was really disappointed when challenging the E4 of Kalos. First of all the fact they all only got 4 pokemon each instead of 5 in previous generations. I also don't like the fact that you can choose the order in which you try to take them on. I'd rather see the old way of predeterminated order return (really hope they do so in OR/AS). At last the overall difficulty of the E4 and champion Diantha was just to low. I beat them in my very first try, without heavy training beforehand and I think many can relate to that. I think they can fix that by increasing the levels of the E4 pokemon and making them smarter, or make it harder to level up your own pokemon (old system of the exp. share). But than again I really like the new exp.share because of post game reasons.
    I assume you skipped Gen V, because both of your complaints (number of Pokemon and freedom of choice over battling order) started there. Also, the EXP Share in this game was essentially a self-imposed Easy Mode, so complaining that the E4 lacked difficulty while using it is a bit unfair. Granted they still weren't challenging either way, but their levels weren't really the issue.

  24. #949
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    I agree that they should give the E4/Champion and hell even the Gym Leaders as well as the leader(s) of the criminal organization in the game, the same AI/IV/EV trained pokemon with items that you find in Battle Maison (Granted in the end if you out level them its near the same) but at least it gives it a challenge.

    Still agree that E4/Champion should have teams of 6 pokemon, makes no sense to have less.

    Lastly, they should make it that every so many times you defeat the Elite4, their levels jump a bit. Say every 5-10 runs, their levels jump by 10 or something. (assuming they start in the 50-ish). Rather than staying stagnant like they did in Kalos.
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    The only X and Y gym leaders I really find challenging are Grant and Clemont, but I imagine that's mostly because of the Pokemon I've used. When I first battled Grant using Quilladin he was really hard, but when I restarted with Frogadier it got a bit easier. With Clemont it's a similar situation to Elesa in Black and White, you need a Ground-type with Rock-type moves to counter the ever-annoying Emolga and its Volt Switch.

    The Elite Four were much easier than I though they would be, even Drasna who I thought was going to be a decent challenge because she uses Dragons, which is rather disappointing. The only Poke in the Elite Four I had any real trouble with was Siebold's Gyarados, and even then that's probably because I wasn't using an Electric-type.

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