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Thread: Talonflame Discussion Thread

  1. #26
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    Except supposedly Pokebank doesnt transfer items (thx gibbsy!) so technically in 6th gen brave bird will ALWAYS be stronger than acro+flying gem due tothe absence of flying gem

    Supposedly.

  2. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Klaus™ View Post
    Except supposedly Pokebank doesnt transfer items (thx gibbsy!) so technically in 6th gen brave bird will ALWAYS be stronger than acro+flying gem due tothe absence of flying gem

    Supposedly.
    you can get gems by smashing rocks in kalos smart one

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    Just some food for thought.

    252+ Atk Sharp Beak (custom) Brave Bird vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Slowbro: 127-151 (32.23 - 38.32%) -- 1.76% chance to 3HKO
    (127, 129, 130, 132, 133, 135, 136, 138, 139, 141, 142, 144, 145, 147, 148, 151)

    252+ Atk (custom) Sky Attack vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Slowbro: 124-147 (31.47 - 37.3%) -- guaranteed 4HKO
    (124, 126, 127, 129, 130, 132, 133, 135, 136, 138, 139, 141, 142, 144, 145, 147)

    Sky Attack won't even outdamage Sharp Beak boosted Brave Bird. No reason to use it. Ever.



    Quote Originally Posted by ghost_dog97 View Post
    you can get gems by smashing rocks in kalos smart one
    Seriously dude? People disagree with you and you get defensive over that?
    “The God of the old Testament is arguably the most unpleasant character in all fiction: jealous and proud of it; petty, unjust, unforgiving, control freak; a vindictive, bloodthirsty, ethnic cleanser; a misogynistic, homophobic, racist, infanticidal, genocidal, filicidal, pestilential, megalomaniacal, sadomasochistic, capriciously malevolent bully. Those of us schooled from infancy in his ways can become desensitized to their horror."

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  4. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Divine Retribution View Post
    Just some food for thought.

    252+ Atk Sharp Beak (custom) Brave Bird vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Slowbro: 127-151 (32.23 - 38.32%) -- 1.76% chance to 3HKO
    (127, 129, 130, 132, 133, 135, 136, 138, 139, 141, 142, 144, 145, 147, 148, 151)

    252+ Atk (custom) Sky Attack vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Slowbro: 124-147 (31.47 - 37.3%) -- guaranteed 4HKO
    (124, 126, 127, 129, 130, 132, 133, 135, 136, 138, 139, 141, 142, 144, 145, 147)

    Sky Attack won't even outdamage Sharp Beak boosted Brave Bird. No reason to use it. Ever.





    Seriously dude? People disagree with you and you get defensive over that?
    lmao, but its true! I got a normal gem, a fire gem, AND a flying gem by smashing random rocks in random caves

  5. #30

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    Quote Originally Posted by ghost_dog97 View Post
    lmao, but its true! I got a normal gem, a fire gem, AND a flying gem by smashing random rocks in random caves
    Wait, this was on X or Y? Do you have pictures of this? Because people everywhere have been waiting for (heck, practically salivating over) the possibility of finding other gems besides the Normal Gem in X and Y.

    It should be noted that according to several tests, gems only boost a move by 30% now. Still, 143 BP on the first Acrobatics is still pretty solid.

  6. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by jesusfreak94 View Post
    Wait, this was on X or Y? Do you have pictures of this? Because people everywhere have been waiting for (heck, practically salivating over) the possibility of finding other gems besides the Normal Gem in X and Y.

    It should be noted that according to several tests, gems only boost a move by 30% now. Still, 143 BP on the first Acrobatics is still pretty solid.
    yes sir its in x and y, I traveled to different caves too so don't just stay stationary in one cave.

  7. #32

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    Quote Originally Posted by ghost_dog97 View Post
    yes sir its in x and y, I traveled to different caves too so don't just stay stationary in one cave.
    Ok, cool. Could you please get a picture of them in the game? If you could, you would really make Talonflame's day since no one has been able to confirm the presence of anything but the Normal Gem so far. As far as we know, the Flying Gem is unavailable, so getting real evidence of that would be awesome.

  8. #33
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    I cannot post a picture from my game because Idk how to upload it onto my computer

  9. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by ghost_dog97 View Post
    I cannot post a picture from my game because Idk how to upload it onto my computer
    you take a picture with a camera and upload it from there, tho sometimes the pictures come out bad.

    As an alternative to a flying gem i could see a weakening berry being used, such as a passho to give it more staying power against threats such as rotom, but is overall inferior, but is still worth a mention i think due to its ability to give it more staying power, tho in that case, return would be a good idea so you can actually muscle through rotom wash, its a 2hko at +2.



  10. #35
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    ...oh, try rock smashing and dowsing machine in terminus cave! that's where I found my normal gem and fire gem...
    OH CRIPES, I FORGOT THAT I GOT FLYING GEM VIA PICKUP!!!!!!!!!
    sorry dude =(

  11. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by ghost_dog97 View Post
    ...oh, try rock smashing and dowsing machine in terminus cave! that's where I found my normal gem and fire gem...
    OH CRIPES, I FORGOT THAT I GOT FLYING GEM VIA PICKUP!!!!!!!!!
    sorry dude =(
    hmm you can take a picture of the item in your bag as no one has yet been able to hack the 3ds, so it makes it legitimate. I`ld assume that they`ld bring gems back like that due to pokebank not letting you move items.



  12. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by Divine Retribution View Post
    Except for the part where you suggested Sharp Beak and Acrobatics on the same set.

    And Brave Bird with Focus Sash. And Sky Attack at all.
    correction, I said focus sash with swords dance (followed by acrobatics), and sharp beak with brave bird, and power herb with sky attack
    for a person who is really smart, you should've known that I didn't say focus sash and brave bird on the same set

  13. #38
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    Pretty sure he doesn't have a flying Gem.
    I doubt out of all the people using pick up, including me, he is the only one to come across a Flying Gem.
    No other gem has been found except Normal. So, I'm a bit skeptical on that.

    But, as soon as it is legal AcroGem Talon flame FTW. :3
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  14. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by ghost_dog97 View Post
    correction, I said focus sash with swords dance (followed by acrobatics), and sharp beak with brave bird, and power herb with sky attack
    for a person who is really smart, you should've known that I didn't say focus sash and brave bird on the same set
    Given the quality of your other posts I was shooting a bit low.



    +2 252+ Atk Flying Gem (custom) Acrobatics (110 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Slowbro: 291-343 (73.85 - 87.05%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
    (291, 294, 298, 301, 304, 309, 312, 315, 318, 322, 325, 328, 333, 336, 339, 343)

    +2 252+ Atk Flying Gem (custom) Acrobatics (110 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Chansey: 570-672 (80.96 - 95.45%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
    (570, 577, 583, 591, 597, 604, 610, 618, 624, 631, 637, 645, 651, 658, 664, 672)

    +2 252+ Atk Flying Gem (custom) Acrobatics (110 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Donphan: 273-322 (71.09 - 83.85%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
    (273, 276, 280, 283, 286, 289, 292, 295, 298, 303, 306, 309, 312, 315, 318, 322)


    +2 252+ Atk Flying Gem (custom) Acrobatics (110 BP) vs. 252 HP / 48+ Def Ferrothorn: 298-352 (84.65 - 100%) -- 6.25% chance to OHKO
    (298, 303, 306, 309, 313, 316, 319, 324, 327, 330, 334, 337, 340, 345, 348, 352)


    +2 252+ Atk Flying Gem (custom) Acrobatics (110 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Hippowdon: 277-327 (65.95 - 77.85%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
    (277, 280, 283, 286, 291, 294, 297, 300, 303, 306, 310, 313, 316, 319, 322, 327)

    +2 252+ Atk Flying Gem (custom) Acrobatics (110 BP) vs. 244 HP / 248+ Def Gliscor: 267-315 (75.85 - 89.48%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
    (267, 270, 273, 276, 279, 283, 286, 289, 292, 295, 298, 301, 304, 307, 310, 315)


    A lot of Pokemon that are usually safe switch-ins just get hammered by a +2 Flying Gem Acrobatics.
    EDIT: Yeah I realize Ferrothorn is on this list and no sane person would ever switch Ferrothorn into Talonflame. Deal with it.
    EDIT2: If there's anything to take away from this I think it's that Talonflame wants hazards and lots of them, cause they turn 2HKOs into OHKOs.
    Last edited by Divine Retribution; 9th November 2013 at 12:05 AM.
    “The God of the old Testament is arguably the most unpleasant character in all fiction: jealous and proud of it; petty, unjust, unforgiving, control freak; a vindictive, bloodthirsty, ethnic cleanser; a misogynistic, homophobic, racist, infanticidal, genocidal, filicidal, pestilential, megalomaniacal, sadomasochistic, capriciously malevolent bully. Those of us schooled from infancy in his ways can become desensitized to their horror."

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  15. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by Divine Retribution View Post
    Given the quality of your other posts I was shooting a bit low.



    +2 252+ Atk Flying Gem (custom) Acrobatics (110 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Slowbro: 291-343 (73.85 - 87.05%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
    (291, 294, 298, 301, 304, 309, 312, 315, 318, 322, 325, 328, 333, 336, 339, 343)

    +2 252+ Atk Flying Gem (custom) Acrobatics (110 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Chansey: 570-672 (80.96 - 95.45%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
    (570, 577, 583, 591, 597, 604, 610, 618, 624, 631, 637, 645, 651, 658, 664, 672)

    +2 252+ Atk Flying Gem (custom) Acrobatics (110 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Donphan: 273-322 (71.09 - 83.85%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
    (273, 276, 280, 283, 286, 289, 292, 295, 298, 303, 306, 309, 312, 315, 318, 322)


    +2 252+ Atk Flying Gem (custom) Acrobatics (110 BP) vs. 252 HP / 48+ Def Ferrothorn: 298-352 (84.65 - 100%) -- 6.25% chance to OHKO
    (298, 303, 306, 309, 313, 316, 319, 324, 327, 330, 334, 337, 340, 345, 348, 352)


    +2 252+ Atk Flying Gem (custom) Acrobatics (110 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Hippowdon: 277-327 (65.95 - 77.85%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
    (277, 280, 283, 286, 291, 294, 297, 300, 303, 306, 310, 313, 316, 319, 322, 327)

    +2 252+ Atk Flying Gem (custom) Acrobatics (110 BP) vs. 244 HP / 248+ Def Gliscor: 267-315 (75.85 - 89.48%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
    (267, 270, 273, 276, 279, 283, 286, 289, 292, 295, 298, 301, 304, 307, 310, 315)


    A lot of Pokemon that are usually safe switch-ins just get hammered by a +2 Flying Gem Acrobatics.
    EDIT: Yeah I realize Ferrothorn is on this list and no sane person would ever switch Ferrothorn into Talonflame. Deal with it.
    EDIT2: If there's anything to take away from this I think it's that Talonflame wants hazards and lots of them, cause they turn 2HKOs into OHKOs.
    Did you do these calcs with the new power behind the gems? They're no longer x1.5, they're x1.3.
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  16. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by MuhFugginMoose View Post
    Did you do these calcs with the new power behind the gems? They're no longer x1.5, they're x1.3.
    Hmm, no, I didn't even know that. I'll redo them later with the 1.3x power, but that still shows the ridiculous power of this thing.
    “The God of the old Testament is arguably the most unpleasant character in all fiction: jealous and proud of it; petty, unjust, unforgiving, control freak; a vindictive, bloodthirsty, ethnic cleanser; a misogynistic, homophobic, racist, infanticidal, genocidal, filicidal, pestilential, megalomaniacal, sadomasochistic, capriciously malevolent bully. Those of us schooled from infancy in his ways can become desensitized to their horror."

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  17. #42

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    Is there solid evidence of the Flying Gem yet? If not, all of those calcs are moot (even not counting the fact that gems were nerfed). The next best bet is Sharp Beak Brave Bird (I guess there's Life Orb, but you have to ask if that extra recoil is worth ~8% more power), so here's that list with that instead of Flying Gem Acrobatics:

    +2 252+ Atk Sharp Beak Charizard Brave Bird vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Slowbro: 255-300 (64.72 - 76.14%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

    +2 252+ Atk Sharp Beak Charizard Brave Bird vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Chansey: 499-588 (70.88 - 83.52%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

    +2 252+ Atk Sharp Beak Charizard Brave Bird vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Donphan: 238-282 (61.97 - 73.43%) -- guaranteed 2HKO (I'm kinda wondering why Donphan is still relevant)

    +2 252+ Atk Sharp Beak Charizard Brave Bird vs. 252 HP / 48+ Def Ferrothorn: 261-307 (74.14 - 87.21%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

    +2 252+ Atk Sharp Beak Charizard Brave Bird vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Hippowdon: 241-285 (57.38 - 67.85%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

    +2 252+ Atk Sharp Beak Charizard Brave Bird vs. 244 HP / 248+ Def Gliscor: 232-274 (65.9 - 77.84%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

    It's still a lot of damage, but you're missing out on a lot of potential KOs after hazards that you would have had otherwise. The fact that the Flying Gem (if it's ever discovered) might follow in the footsteps of the Normal Gem and only provide a 1.3x boost doesn't help much either.

  18. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by jesusfreak94 View Post
    +2 252+ Atk Sharp Beak Charizard Brave Bird vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Donphan: 238-282 (61.97 - 73.43%) -- guaranteed 2HKO (I'm kinda wondering why Donphan is still relevant)
    It's not really, I just calc'd it against every physical wall I could think of in 5 seconds.
    “The God of the old Testament is arguably the most unpleasant character in all fiction: jealous and proud of it; petty, unjust, unforgiving, control freak; a vindictive, bloodthirsty, ethnic cleanser; a misogynistic, homophobic, racist, infanticidal, genocidal, filicidal, pestilential, megalomaniacal, sadomasochistic, capriciously malevolent bully. Those of us schooled from infancy in his ways can become desensitized to their horror."

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  19. #44
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    Talonflame is pretty amazing. Priority brave bird means blaziken will never be an issue.

  20. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tropius19 View Post
    Talonflame is pretty amazing. Priority brave bird means blaziken will never be an issue.
    The same could be said for most fighting types, in addition to Volcarona, who Talonflame can easily check even after a Quiver Dance.
    I make no claim of being perfect or always right. Take everything I say with a grain of salt.

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    Hello best acrobatics spammer (probably). It gets priority flying moves. That's pretty darn good. Not much stops it after SD. It's (I think) the 3rd most commonly used pokemon in gen6OU. Maybe that's just hype, but I gotta admit it's great.

    I think physically defensive Rotom W is a solid counter



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    Quote Originally Posted by Minedreigon View Post
    Hello best acrobatics spammer (probably). It gets priority flying moves. That's pretty darn good. Not much stops it after SD. It's (I think) the 3rd most commonly used pokemon in gen6OU. Maybe that's just hype, but I gotta admit it's great.

    I think physically defensive Rotom W is a solid counter
    I still think Hawlucha will be the best AcroSpammer lol.

    I just want to cause some contrversy here and say that Talonflame is OU material.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eaglehawk View Post
    I just want to cause some contrversy here and say that Talonflame is OU material.
    I don't think that's so controversial. It's got some flaws in its underwhelming stats (barring speed), a nasty stealth rock weakness, and some things that hard counter it (Rotom-W, Normal/Mega Tyranitar, Heatran), but priority Brave Bird, Roost, and Acrobatics are unprecedented. It's not unreasonable to think it could make it in OU, and if it's not, it'll be BL for sure.
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  24. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eaglehawk View Post

    I just want to cause some contrversy here and say that Talonflame is OU material.
    I don't think anyone here will disagree with ya there.
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  25. #50
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    Man everyone was having a screamfest over whether Talonflame is OU material or BL material like Staraptor.

    Didn't realize there would be a general consensus here.
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