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Thread: A Blustery Santalune Gym Battle! (808)

  1. #101
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    I actually liked the episode. Pikachu's loss seemed believable. Fletchling seems to be doing pretty good too. And training...that's always a plus point in my book.

  2. #102
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    A very nicely written episode, with a gym battle that already outclasses most of the last eight, despite it ending with a loss! I found the loss to be completely acceptable and I love that Bug Pokemon are being shown off in such a powerful way.

    Pikachu having trouble on the ice was nice to see. It made sense when compared to the rubbish they usually throw at us like a Pokemon rebounding off pillars and rocks while taking no damage, using fast moves in perfect circles without slipping, or suddenly becoming Tony Hawk and skating around the field.

    Bonnie whipped out her "find Clemont a bride" bit for the first time, which was absolutely adorable and I love that he used the Aipom Arm to drag her away out of pure embarrassment. I believe that was the first time I've actually chuckled aloud at Pokemon since sometime in late AG/early DP.. Oh and the high 'ten?' jump with Serena was lovely to see too; I can already tell that they're going to bond over something.. Probably grooming, considering Bonnie's previously shown love for cleaning up the Pokemon..

    Overall an excellent episode, with the perfect cliff hanger ending ("Do you remember me?"). It's been a long time since I praised a Pokemon episode this much, so bravo writers, please make sure that you keep it up!

  3. #103
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    I really appreciate the emotional bond that Ash has built with his Fletchling already, it fought so hard for him! This was a great episode in general, with Serena's introduction to the group too! It was refreshing, in my opinion, to see a Surskit used well, as well as a menacing Vivillon!
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  4. #104
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    This was a very entertaining episode which gives me high hopes for the entire series. There's a lot of really interesting things they're doing with animations and music and it's certainly appreciated.

    On the character development field I'm also pleased. Serena definitely has a unique character. She is excited but seems to lack some confidence. Her connection to Ash and that cliffhanger has so far been executed very well. I'm eagerly looking forward to that and how their relationship develops. I'm interested getting the dub so I can learn more about Alexa and Viola's relationship and what Serena has said.

    The small quirks in these episodes like Eureka's parts are refreshing and entertaining.
    Last edited by Dephender; 9th November 2013 at 12:22 AM.
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  5. #105
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    I liked this episode, nothing really bothered me. I liked that Fletchling is his first basic stage bird to actually get a win.

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  6. #106
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    Battle was gorgeous, with great battle theme remixes in tandem.

    Ash lost but it was still pretty good match. And I especially like that Alexa vouched for Ash's skill. No more treating him like a scrub pls.

    Best of all its leading directly into "special training" too...Hopefully they'll take a page out of DP and turn this into something useful for the future. (Like the Contest twirls > Mid-Air Spin-Dodge > Counter Shield thing)

    Lastly, Serena was precious all episode :3 Like those flashbacks weren't enough...I'm not big on Pokemon ships, but I feel like supporting this one!
    Last edited by Emperor Empoleon; 8th November 2013 at 3:04 AM.
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  7. #107
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    Another week of suspense over this thing with Ash and Serena. Please deliver next week writers. But anyway, great episode and I'm glad Fletchling scored a win.


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  8. #108
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    regarding the bird, does it have a fourth attack or was it simply using Razor Wind energy on it's wings in previous episodes?

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    Quote Originally Posted by shac View Post
    I actually liked the episode. Pikachu's loss seemed believable.
    I don't see how Pikachu getting hit by one attack is a believable way for him to lose. I mean Surskit's tactics aside, how does Pikachu lose to a Signal Beam attack? I just don't get it. It makes no sense unless you believe that Pikachu regressed again which I'm starting to believe. It's really disappointing that Pikachu didn't even get to battle Viola's main Pokemon.

  10. #110
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    Quote Originally Posted by Charmed View Post
    I don't see how Pikachu getting hit by one attack is a believable way for him to lose. I mean Surskit's tactics aside, how does Pikachu lose to a Signal Beam attack? I just don't get it. It makes no sense unless you believe that Pikachu regressed again which I'm starting to believe. It's really disappointing that Pikachu didn't even get to battle Viola's main Pokemon.
    the explosion from the mishap thunderbolt colliding with Ice Beam obviously did some of the damage, again though Pikachu's guard was down at that point, many a time in this anime has a pokemon dropped becaused they lowered their defensive guard.

  11. #111
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    Quote Originally Posted by Charmed View Post
    I don't see how Pikachu getting hit by one attack is a believable way for him to lose. I mean Surskit's tactics aside, how does Pikachu lose to a Signal Beam attack? I just don't get it. It makes no sense unless you believe that Pikachu regressed again which I'm starting to believe. It's really disappointing that Pikachu didn't even get to battle Viola's main Pokemon.
    I believe most of the reason why Ash's Pokemon survive a lot of the attacks are for 2 reasons:

    1. They are conscious enough to brace for the attack.
    2. Ash's encouraging words

    Neither option was available to Pikachu.

    What some people are not remembering is after the ice beam thunderbolt explosion Pikachu was on its back trying to recover from the blast. Surskit than proceeded to use signal beam, on a defenseless, incapacitated Pikachu.

    I'm pretty sure, when someone punches you it will hurt a lot more if you aren't expecting it enough to embrace the attack,

    A lot like the move "endure" in Pokemon games, however if you don't use endure, you'll be knocked out.

    It's that simple, Pikachu was pretty incapacitated, trying to recover, when suddenly it got hit with a signal beam. I have no idea why anyone would expect Pikachu to recover from that.
    Misinterpreting my posts is not your fault, negative repping me, and getting very sensitive about my posts because you misinterpreted my posts however is your fault. Think really hard, before negative repping or making a big deal about my posts. I don't appreciate being negative repped for reasons that are a result of misinterpreting my posts.

  12. #112
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    Eh, Pikachu has always been a glass cannon so to speak so why anybody is shocked is beyond me.

    I'm just thrilled my baby Fletchling got it's first win in a gym no less and is the first bird to do you <3!!!
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    Quote Originally Posted by Almighty Zard View Post
    the explosion from the mishap thunderbolt colliding with Ice Beam obviously did some of the damage, again though Pikachu's guard was down at that point, many a time in this anime has a pokemon dropped becaused they lowered their defensive guard.
    I wouldn't say Pikachu's guard was down; he saw the attack coming after all. He just didn't get up fast enough but even so, him getting hit by Signal Beam shouldn't have ended the battle. I was pleased that he at least scored a hit with Iron Tail, but to see him lose in such a manner right afterwards is embarrassing.

  14. #114
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    If there is already going to be a rematch episode, I wouldn't expect some even, drawn-out battle for the initial round. Plus, at least with the way Pikachu lost, Ash and others recognize that him and his Pokemon were unprepared or underestimated their opponent. If Pikachu barely lost after a long back-and-forth fight, you can't really make that claim - then it would simply be Pikachu got outplayed. I actually wouldn't be happy with that outcome. So to be honest, I thought it was fine the way Pikachu lost.
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  15. #115
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    I’ll start off on what I liked about this episode, Viola, Alexa, Bonnie and the battle rocked this episode in many areas for me. Alexa, I found pretty humdrum in all of Da! but she’s become much better in XY so far. It seems like she has more a personality and spice about herself in-general, back in the first episode her facial expressions and reactions to Ash getting worked up over Viola not being present, her watching the battle with so much fire, the discussion she had with her sister on Ash and the training she’s helping him continue to forego with. She just held overall more of a presence regularly in an episode outside of her little exposition with Gogoat back in Da! That’s a good thing, I hope this is some type of small foreshadowing of her at least battling Viola in the first as well. It’s like watching her sister awakened something within herself.

    Viola was fierce, she was a nicely characterized gym leader and I liked all her camera-laced dialogue(focus Signal Beam!, shutter chance!) and I’m glad they didn’t neglect that aspect of her from the games. She was fiery during the battle, it was a fun battle to watch from her side because she was quite to the tactician and fun to watch, I really mean that. I found myself rooting for her than Ash at times. She’s definitely the type of chick who utilizes brutal conventions conventions and tactics to unsettle her opponents in combat and mercilessly goes in for the kill when her opponents are immobilized. I enjoyed every minute of it what she did, even the camera hands she made before the final shot Solar Beam. Was awesome and she looked so strong alongside her Bug Pokemon.

    Can we just have more Bonnie in this show? Because I feel like more Bonnie would help it a lot. The little girl’s proposal to Viola and how over-the-top she was with even throwing in some french was funny to watch, all the while wearing Dedenne as a crown in the scenes before and after were brilliant.(Hopefully the bride gag isn’t overused.) She’s such an enjoyable character so far in XY, even during the battle when she commented on the ice field Dedenne throws in a few “ne ne!” which is probably a pun in the Japanese version of the show with Dedenne agreeing with Bonnie, yes the field is frozen. XD Then her scenes with calling Serena Onee-chan and than celebrating Yayakoma’s victory by slapping hands with her were adorable. I don’t think I could ever hate such a character.

    Cons about the episode? Well I can’t pretend there weren't any. As enjoyable as Viola and her strategic methods were the battle suffered from being too short. I expected they would at least spend half the episode on it, but they didn’t and it really went by too quickly. Surskit barely took any damage and went down too quickly for my taste to Fletchling, a newly-caught bird, you don’t really expect that out of a gym leader’s Pokemon, especially one that managed to put Pikachu away in two hits no less. Then again with Vivillion taking on Fletchling, it was just too easy. I know they wanted to establish Vivillion as this beast mode butterfly right off the bat but I think at least showing Fletchling as somewhat competent against it would have been more satisfying and would have made the whole final bout feel less curb-stompy. It managing to render Surskit helpless only to be ruled completely obsolete against Vivillion just felt so weird. I hope in the rematch that the preview is playing tricks on my eyes and Viola uses an evolved Surskit as a Masquerain to shake things up a little bit.


    Oh yeah….I feel like I should mention it so..yeah, there was some AmourShipping. So, yeah, enjoy that shipping, shipper super fans.
    Last edited by Dephender; 9th November 2013 at 12:23 AM.

  16. #116
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    Honestly I was impressed with the gym battle and the tactics Viola brought. What was surprising was how her tactics kind of reflected the bug type, the whole immobalize your opponent than go in for the kill. Wether it was the writers intention or a complete fluke I found it preety smart. Now with Ash, even though I found his emotions a bit exaggerated, thank god he didn't cry, atleast Ash regained his drive he lost after Sinnoh. The fact he actually took the loss with a grain of salt shows me that he's still actually invested in becoming a Pokemon Master. And if anything I'm glad he lost so we can finally go back to Ash actually training his pokemon which he severally lacked in BW. Also I'm glad there back to using strategies which really is the only thing that makes the pokemon battles in the anime interesting. With the ability to take in account the terrain, pokemon sizes, and how moves can be preformed the writers can make very interesting situations as we saw in the first gym battle. Outside of the battle though we saw for the first time Bonnie's gag with finding Clemont a wife, and also Serena finally making it to the group only to get interrupted every time she tries to talk to Ash. On a side note anyone find that Serena's crossing a bit over the line to being a Yandere. Depending on Ash's reaction I'd advise him to sleep with one eye open. Thoughts of Serena standing beside his bed whispering in his ear "Do you remember me...?"

  17. #117
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    Red face A nice season to look forward to

    I really like the XY saga. I mean I really do! I thought I had lost interest in the anime due to black and white, but boy, was I wrong! I'm enjoying the strategy and the soundtracks they play for the battles. Needless to say, battles are the favourite part of the episode for me. All of the battles shown so far are amazing!


    Quote Originally Posted by Charmed View Post
    I wouldn't say Pikachu's guard was down; he saw the attack coming after all. He just didn't get up fast enough but even so, him getting hit by Signal Beam shouldn't have ended the battle. I was pleased that he at least scored a hit with Iron Tail, but to see him lose in such a manner right afterwards is embarrassing.

    Well, I think we really ought to change the way of seeing the anime through the game's vantage point, and judging Pokémon battles purely by experience of parties involved and damage taken.
    This has been pointed out in this discussion before, but let me emphasize this: The anime is way more realistic than the games when it comes to battles. Let me walk through the battle that has caused so much controversy and try to analyse the outcome.

    Surskit is a pretty strong Pokémon, and agile too. Soon after the battle started, he transformed the arena to his advantage.
    Surskit is based on the bug commonly called 'pond skater'. I've seen them in, well, ponds near my locality. They slide over water very fast. (according to our trusty ol' wiki, the speed is over 1m/s!)

    So this Pokémon is very mush based on that bug. And as seen, its fast. Ice is very similar to water in that it supports skating due to less friction, and Suskrit has just the right legs for that. Pikachu is faster on a normal battlefield, but there is no question of Suskrit's superiority when the field was ice'd. The terrain not only gave suskrit a huge speed boost, but also made Pikachu lose balance occasionally. Wholly understandable. Pikachu's normally agile nature will not help a bit here, so Pikachu was effectively trapped.


    The second thing I'd like to emphasize is exhaustion. Consider a boxer practicing on a punching bag. After a few solid hours, he's bound to be exhausted. He might lose with a single punch thrown at him by a less experienced boxer, if he's exhausted enough.

    Here, Pikachu used some attacks that didn't hit. His thunderbolt was cancelled and overpowered by ice beam. These attacks surely took a lot out of him. I mean he is a pretty small pokemon relatively speaking, so the amount of energy he can store in that body at a given time is not very high. Yes, he has beaten legendaries, but tat doesn't mean that he cannot lose.

    The terrain was against him. Ash did not have a proper strategy. Suskrit is in his home ground executing a strategy honed by practice. I don't think its highly unbelievable that he lost. DOn't think he was OHKO'd by signal beam. The attacks launched by Pikachu took some toll on him. This is what makes the anime more realistic and what sets it apart from the games.

    The reason Ice beam overpowered Pikachu's attack is because Pikachu didn't have a firm ground to stand on. He cannot exert as much forward force as he'd like because he'd move backwards and slip. Thus the momentum of his attack was low.

    That concudes the mini-lecture. Lol... sorry if I came off as boring, but I wanted to clear some stuff up...

  18. #118
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    I forgot to mention this last time but I absolutely loved the music this episode, especially during the battles. It gives the battles a certain dynamic when good battle music plays.

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    I wished they found another way for Pikachu to lose. Pikachu's battled on an all ice field before.

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    Quote Originally Posted by DedicatedFan View Post
    I wished they found another way for Pikachu to lose. Pikachu's battled on an all ice field before.
    Maybe using Froakie would have been more better. Despite Pikachu's status, it would have been more different and made more sense if Ash lost using the bird and the frog.

    My ideal battle ever!

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    Quote Originally Posted by DedicatedFan View Post
    I wished they found another way for Pikachu to lose. Pikachu's battled on an all ice field before.
    This is the only fault I have... but people seem to think because there were no pillars, Pikachu had a reason to lose.

    Well I went back and watched the Pikachu vs Piloswine battle... Pikachu only used the pillars once to confuse it. In that battle, Pikachu used the Ice to his own advantage, using his momentum to slide. He also was able to stop himself despite facing backwards in Blizzard (which unless all sorts of logic is thrown out, should have pushed him even further)
    Last edited by Joltik-Kid; 8th November 2013 at 3:46 PM.
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  22. #122
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    Quote Originally Posted by Joltik-Kid View Post
    This is the only fault I have... but people seem to think because there were no pillars, Pikachu had a reason to lose.

    Well I went back and watched the Pikachu vs Piloswine battle... Pikachu only used the pillars once to confuse it. In that battle, Pikachu used the Ice to his own advantage, using his momentum to slide. He also was able to stop himself despite facing backwards in Blizzard (which unless all sorts of logic is thrown out, should have pushed him even further)
    It been years when Ash's Pikachu has been on an Ice field

    Quote Originally Posted by Caseydia View Post
    Maybe using Froakie would have been more better. Despite Pikachu's status, it would have been more different and made more sense if Ash lost using the bird and the frog.
    Will it wouldn't make any sense if Ash use Frokie because it would have ended the same way.

  23. #123
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    Quote Originally Posted by Analon View Post
    I really like the XY saga. I mean I really do! I thought I had lost interest in the anime due to black and white, but boy, was I wrong! I'm enjoying the strategy and the soundtracks they play for the battles. Needless to say, battles are the favourite part of the episode for me. All of the battles shown so far are amazing!





    Well, I think we really ought to change the way of seeing the anime through the game's vantage point, and judging Pokémon battles purely by experience of parties involved and damage taken.
    This has been pointed out in this discussion before, but let me emphasize this: The anime is way more realistic than the games when it comes to battles. Let me walk through the battle that has caused so much controversy and try to analyse the outcome.

    Surskit is a pretty strong Pokémon, and agile too. Soon after the battle started, he transformed the arena to his advantage.
    Surskit is based on the bug commonly called 'pond skater'. I've seen them in, well, ponds near my locality. They slide over water very fast. (according to our trusty ol' wiki, the speed is over 1m/s!)

    So this Pokémon is very mush based on that bug. And as seen, its fast. Ice is very similar to water in that it supports skating due to less friction, and Suskrit has just the right legs for that. Pikachu is faster on a normal battlefield, but there is no question of Suskrit's superiority when the field was ice'd. The terrain not only gave suskrit a huge speed boost, but also made Pikachu lose balance occasionally. Wholly understandable. Pikachu's normally agile nature will not help a bit here, so Pikachu was effectively trapped.


    The second thing I'd like to emphasize is exhaustion. Consider a boxer practicing on a punching bag. After a few solid hours, he's bound to be exhausted. He might lose with a single punch thrown at him by a less experienced boxer, if he's exhausted enough.

    Here, Pikachu used some attacks that didn't hit. His thunderbolt was cancelled and overpowered by ice beam. These attacks surely took a lot out of him. I mean he is a pretty small pokemon relatively speaking, so the amount of energy he can store in that body at a given time is not very high. Yes, he has beaten legendaries, but tat doesn't mean that he cannot lose.

    The terrain was against him. Ash did not have a proper strategy. Suskrit is in his home ground executing a strategy honed by practice. I don't think its highly unbelievable that he lost. DOn't think he was OHKO'd by signal beam. The attacks launched by Pikachu took some toll on him. This is what makes the anime more realistic and what sets it apart from the games.

    The reason Ice beam overpowered Pikachu's attack is because Pikachu didn't have a firm ground to stand on. He cannot exert as much forward force as he'd like because he'd move backwards and slip. Thus the momentum of his attack was low.

    That concudes the mini-lecture. Lol... sorry if I came off as boring, but I wanted to clear some stuff up...
    Can people please read this lol. You are absolutely right sir .
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  24. #124
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    Skating on Ice is like a Bicycle, it's hard at first, but once you get the hang of it you never forget... Well apparently Pikachu did XD
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    Quote Originally Posted by p96822 View Post
    It been years when Ash's Pikachu has been on an Ice field


    .
    This is blatantly false. The time from episode one to the start of BW is less than one year, and unless you have spacific proof that BW took place over several years then there is no basis to saying Pikachu has been off the ice for years.

    And besides there isn't really much he could improve for the next battle anyways. I'm pretty sure the end result would be people

    ………………..,-~*’`Żlllllll`*~,
    …………..,-~*`lllllllllllllllllllllllllll...
    ………,-~*lllllllllllllllllllllllllllllll...
    ……,-*lllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllll...
    ….;*`lllllllllllllllllllllllllll,-~*~-...
    …..\lllllllllllllllllllllllllll/………\;;...
    …...\lllllllllllllllllllll,-*………..`~-~...
    …….\llllllllllll,-~*…………………)_-\..*`*;....
    ……..\,-*`Ż,*`)…………,-~*`~.………….../
    ……...|/.../…/~,…...-~*,-~*`;……………./.\
    ……../.../…/…/..,-,..*~,.`*~*…………….*......
    …….|.../…/…/.*`...\...……………………)….)Ż`~,
    …….|./…/…./…….)……,.)`*~-,……….../….|..)...
    ……/./.../…,*`-,…..`-,…*`….,---…...\…./...
    …...(……….)`*~-,….`*`.,-~*.,-*……|…/.…/…...
    …….*-,…….`*-,...`~,..``.,,,-*……….|.,*....
    ……….*,………`-,…)-,…………..,-* `...,-*….(`-,...

    ing at how Ash didn't do that the first time.
    Last edited by LizardonX; 8th November 2013 at 4:31 PM.

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