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Thread: Official Serebii 6th Gen Singles Tier List & Standard Rules Discussion Thread

  1. #101
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    Quote Originally Posted by KillerDraco View Post
    The same could be said for most Pokemon though. Being checked by a Scarfer isn't exactly unique to Mega Lucario, and again, it's only a check, not a counter. Most Scarfers couldn't switch into Mega Lucario given they're either 1HKO'd by the Close Combat, or if they're not, the follow-up priority would usually be enough to finish them off. It would be necessary to sacrifice a Pokemon just to check him, given he had few (if any) safe switch-ins, was part of the reason for his downfall. Plus, overcentralizing and all that jazz.
    ... That's what I was saying...

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    Last edited by Cloneblazer12; 19th February 2014 at 2:47 PM.

  2. #102
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    Am I the only one that thinks Kyuerm Black should be banned?

    Also, Megazard and Megsir are both tolerable in OU, if you think they should be banned. We should just ban every mega expect for manatric

  3. #103
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    Kyurem-B's always been sort of borderline due to its absurd attack stat and respectable special attack to muscle through would-be counters. Fortuately it has a lot of things that check it due to its ice typing giving it some unfortunate weaknesses, and its Stealth Rock weakness helps keep it in check too. It did get a more reliable counter in Sylveon, who can shrug off pretty much all coverage moves and bypass Sub variants with Pixelate Hyper Voice.
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  4. #104
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    Quote Originally Posted by Amaan View Post
    Am I the only one that thinks Kyuerm Black should be banned?

    Also, Megazard and Megsir are both tolerable in OU, if you think they should be banned. We should just ban every mega expect for manatric
    Kyurem black isn't broken now, it has actual counters now like sylveon for the sub set, aegislash, sylveon, and mawile for the choiced sets, I honestly think its perfectly fine. And idk, mega manectic is pretty threatening. in all seriousness, charizard Y is a likely suspect with special attack HIGHER than kyogre plus a good recovery, good speed, good special bulk, and flawless coverage. It basically just comes in and toasts whatever is in or tries to come in with fire blast or standard coverage bar a few things like Chansey, Assault Vest Goodra, and Sp Def Latias



  5. #105
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    Mega Pinsir and Yzard for next suspects IMO.

    Pinsir is pretty ridiculous right now. Not sure if hes ban worthy, but hes pretty borderline. Ive KOed defensive Rotom-W with Return Before, which is saying something.

    Yzard, although good, has a 4X weakness to Stealth Rock, which severely limit his switch in opportunities. Remove your opponent's Spinner/Defogger, and youre half way there. Also his speed is only average at best. I have no complaints with him staying in OU.

    Kyurem might be a suspect, but I doubt he'll get banned.

  6. #106
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    Mega Pinsir still has some difficulty with Skarmory, and can be Revenge killed in a heartbeat by the omnipresent Talonflame. It's got Stealth Rock issues as well, and absolutely hates being burned. Even if it is suspected, it might be able to stay in the tier. I'd agree that it's kinda borderline.
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  7. #107
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    Quote Originally Posted by KillerDraco View Post
    Mega Pinsir still has some difficulty with Skarmory, and can be Revenge killed in a heartbeat by the omnipresent Talonflame. It's got Stealth Rock issues as well, and absolutely hates being burned. Even if it is suspected, it might be able to stay in the tier. I'd agree that it's kinda borderline.
    Thats the thing. The fact that there arent very many hard counters to him is a reason why Smogon would ban him. Personally, I dont have too many problems with him, but hes still a ***** sometimes.

  8. #108
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cloneblazer12 View Post
    Thats the thing. The fact that there arent very many hard counters to him is a reason why Smogon would ban him. Personally, I dont have too many problems with him, but hes still a ***** sometimes.
    I know, I was agreeing with you. There are some very common things that can deal with him well enough, so he's sort of borderline. He's not so difficult to counter as, oh say, Mega Kangaskhan for certain, so I could see him being suspected, but whether or not he'd be banned would be something that would be up for serious debate.
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  9. #109
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    I know you were agreeing with me. I was adding onto what you said...

    The debates at Smogon are entertaining to read. Theres one on Swagplay (prankster + Swagger), and its just turned into a bashing fest...

    Back on topic:

    UU seems to be a bit hectic right now. Of the games that Ive played, Ive only really seen Slowbro commonly, with the occasional Metagross and Hydreigon. Smogon needs to start with balancing the lower tiers right now IMO.

  10. #110
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    UU is pretty balanced atm, only questionable pokemon is Keldeo and that seems perfectly fine imo. Mega Absol is an animal but manageable. I`m glad bisharp got bumped out, it was stupidly good in UU.



  11. #111
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    What I mean is that I never come across the same thing twice perse. Anything that isnt OU or Ubers is UU right now, so I see practically anything...

    Anyways, AV Metagross with Thunderpunch checks Keldeo pretty well, as does SlowBro.

  12. #112
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    Quote Originally Posted by McDanger View Post
    UU is pretty balanced atm, only questionable pokemon is Keldeo and that seems perfectly fine imo. Mega Absol is an animal but manageable. I`m glad bisharp got bumped out, it was stupidly good in UU.
    Ehh They're thinking about suspecting Crawdaunt
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  13. #113
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eaglehawk View Post
    Ehh They're thinking about suspecting Crawdaunt
    Where did you hear about that? Crawdaunt isn't even S-Ranked on the viability ranking thread.

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  14. #114
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    Quote Originally Posted by T-Bolt View Post
    Where did you hear about that? Crawdaunt isn't even S-Ranked on the viability ranking thread.
    S-rank =/= Suspect material

    Knock Off screws up the whole metagame right now, and with his DW ability Adaptability,Choice Band and Aqua Jet + Knock Off + CrabHammer 1-2HKOs the whole meta at this point (bar Chesnaught, but still loses item from a Knock Off switch-in. The sheer power combined with Knock Off's ridiculous utility makes it one of the best, if not one of the most toxic Pokemon in the meta.
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  15. #115
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    I use Crawdaunt in UU and I can confirm what Eaglehawk is saying (about how good he is). Crawdaunt is rediculous right now. He's almost like a mini mega Luke if you think about it. Life Orb Adaptability Aqua Jet 3HKOs many things, and OHKOs many thingy weak to it. It's rediculous.

    Don't even get me started on Knock Off or Crabhammer...

    I use a spread with both speed and HP investment (IDK why, it just seems to work), and Crawdaunt has more physical bulk than people give him credit for.

    Aqua Jet, Crabhammer, Knock Off, and Super Power is really powerful.
    Last edited by Cloneblazer12; 24th February 2014 at 2:28 PM.

  16. #116
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    it its possible they will test knock off in general, UU did, but they didnt find it broken. I honestly dont see why the would suspect crawdaunt when its easily handled with its low speed and low defenses making it easy to check



  17. #117
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    Quote Originally Posted by McDanger View Post
    it its possible they will test knock off in general, UU did, but they didnt find it broken. I honestly dont see why the would suspect crawdaunt when its easily handled with its low speed and low defenses making it easy to check
    It's the word around the forums, then again the quality of posts in almost every Smogon forum's dropped a lot, so you can take that into account I guess.

    Even though it's super-slow and super frail, Adaptability Aqua Jet makes up for it and can OHKO - 2HKO all the frail, fast Pokemon floating around in UU, not to also mention Adaptability Knock Off hurts a lot, even for bulky Pokemon and screws every single switch-in bar Mega-Evos by removing the Pokemon's item.

    On a less important note, Crawdaunt does have Dragon Dance to bypass its low Speed, though that issue's purely accessory.
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  18. #118
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    Quote Originally Posted by McDanger View Post
    it its possible they will test knock off in general, UU did, but they didnt find it broken. I honestly dont see why the would suspect crawdaunt when its easily handled with its low speed and low defenses making it easy to check
    I don't see why they would suspect a move. Smogon has never done this before, and I doubt they'll do it now. Sure, knock off removes an item, and deals pretty good damage, but what about tricking a choice item? Why not ban that too? It's even worse against walls. (I don't want it banned btw, just saying)

    Quote Originally Posted by Eaglehawk View Post
    It's the word around the forums, then again the quality of posts in almost every Smogon forum's dropped a lot, so you can take that into account I guess.

    Even though it's super-slow and super frail, Adaptability Aqua Jet makes up for it and can OHKO - 2HKO all the frail, fast Pokemon floating around in UU, not to also mention Adaptability Knock Off hurts a lot, even for bulky Pokemon and screws every single switch-in bar Mega-Evos by removing the Pokemon's item.

    On a less important note, Crawdaunt does have Dragon Dance to bypass its low Speed, though that issue's purely accessory.
    Crawdaunt isn't that good of a DD user. Base 55? speed isn't that fast, even at +1. Plus, finding time to set up is always a problem. Life Orb +4 attacks is better IMO.

  19. #119
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cloneblazer12 View Post
    I don't see why they would suspect a move. Smogon has never done this before, and I doubt they'll do it now. Sure, knock off removes an item, and deals pretty good damage, but what about tricking a choice item? Why not ban that too? It's even worse against walls. (I don't want it banned btw, just saying)
    at the end of BW2 they were considering suspecting scald iirc, so there is precedent

    Crawdaunt isn't that good of a DD user. Base 55? speed isn't that fast, even at +1. Plus, finding time to set up is always a problem. Life Orb +4 attacks is better IMO.
    It doesn't need Dragon Dance when it has Swords Dance and Choice Band Aqua Jet to completely **** on everything faster than it. You can't switch in because you either die to a Knock Off or be crippled and lose access to your item. Crawdaunt is an extremely deadly wallbreaker and late-game sweeper with double STAB one of the most OP moves in UU (so much stuff here depends on their items like Eviolite Chansey).

  20. #120

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    Double Team, Minimize, and all OHKO moves have been banned for a very long time. I'm not saying I'd support a Knock Off ban, but there's definitely precedent for banning moves. Besides, moves are just one of many aspects of the game, and if one is found to be broken/uncompetitive in general, it should be banned just like any other broken/uncompetitive aspect of the game would be.

  21. #121
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    currently they are considering banning swagplay, tho i'm pro ban here i think its a rather poor idea as the only ones that really abuse this are prankster users, so i think they should just ban it on prankster users but thats just me.



  22. #122
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    Yeah I'd honestly be pro SwagPlay ban because it pretty much falls under the same amount of luck as Sand Veil last gen and evasion boosting moves. Knock Off wise, the only tier where I think it should even be considered for a ban in LC, and only their because of how heavily a Pokemon depends on its item to function. The only move I would consider banning from every tier is Scald, but that's just because of how influential a move it is. Like it literally makes some counters so iffy just because of that 30% chance.

  23. #123

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    I've heard of the Charizard problem because like Lucario and Genesect, it can be physical or special and you don't know until you face it.

  24. #124
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    you have an easier time telling based on the team. Y requires little support while X needs more for weakening physical walls



  25. #125

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    So where will Diancie end up. It's a double wall that can be used as an attacker. I think an Attack/Defense set with Assault Vest could be very deadly.

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