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Thread: Community POTW #024

  1. #1
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    Default Community POTW #024

    Time for the next PotW and this week, we have an ancient Pokémon



    It's the ridiculously bulky Hoenn Fossil, Cradily

    http://www.serebii.net/pokedex-xy/346.shtml

    Go nuts

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    Ability: Storm Drain
    Ingrain
    Protect
    Ancient Power
    Energy Ball
    Item: Big Root
    Nature: Bold/Calm
    EV: 252 Sp. Def, 252 Def, 4 Sp. Att

  3. #3
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    I always had more trouble with Steven’s Claydol than his Cradily (…bloody dual screens) but Cradily should not be underestimated.

    Slightly above average defenses across the board plus two stereotypical defensive types and a wide support movepool make Cradily scream wall (or is it stall?). Both of its attack stats are usable as well which adds a bit of variety.

    Set your roots and rocks
    Cradily –(Storm Drain)
    Item: Leftovers
    -Stealth Rocks
    -Toxic
    -Recover
    -Energy Ball/Grass Knot/Giga Drain/Rock Slide
    Bold (+DEF, -ATK) or Impish (+DEF, -SATK)
    EVs: 252 HP/196 DEF/64 SDEF

    Setup Stealth Rocks, spread a little Toxic, stall with recover, and STAB against taunt. Storm Drain is preferable here as it gives Cradily an additional immunity. Which it sorely needs.

    The Plant’s 65,000,000 year curse
    Cradily –(Storm Drain/Sunction Cups)
    Item: Life Orb/Expert Belt
    -Swords Dance/Curse
    -Seed Bomb
    -Stone Edge
    -Earthquake
    Adamant (+ATK, -SATK)
    EVs 252 HP/252 ATK/4 DEF

    Standard setup and sweep set. Sunction Cups gets a notable mention for blocking phasing attempts from Whirlwind and Roar, allowing Cradily to keep its hard earned boosts.

    Other Options

    -Stockpile/Amnesia/Barrier + Ingrain/Sunction Cups
    Cradily has a huge store of defense boosts and using either Ingrain or Sunction Cups can prevent Cradily from losing them. Gimmick.

    -Sandstorm
    Chip damage + buffing strongest stat. Can’t go wrong with that.

    -Toxic+Bind/Infestation+Sandstorm
    Chip damage galore
    I was once routed by a Gengar who critted 4 times in a row on my team. Morale of the story; Crits happen and Sucker Punch is good Gengar repellent.



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    Pros:
    - Decent enough defences (86/97/107) are okay enough to take a hit
    - Really nice supporting moves, which will be listed in the notable movepool
    - Pretty decent typing negates Grass' weakness to Fire and Flying and Rock's weakness to Water and Ground, all of which are pretty darn common this generation
    - Suction Cups mean that it can set up without fear of Roar, Whirlwind or Dragon Tail
    - 81/81 Offences are ech at best, but means that it can easily run Support, Offence or both at the same time, since the attacking movepool really isn't bad at all
    - It looks really cool
    - With the number of health recovery moves available to our ancient friend, base 86HP isn't bad, but a lack of Leech Seed will hinder this a little

    Cons:
    - Base 107 Special Defence is the best you can do
    - Still weak to Bug, Steel, Ice and Fighting, which are pretty common
    - Anything it cannot touch will set up
    - Storm Drain is okay at best on Cradily, whose SpDef and 1x will mean that most Water moves won't do too much anyway. Slight waste, in my opinion
    - Base 43 Defence. Good luck with that outside of Trick Room

    Notable movepool:
    Support
    Stockpile
    Amnesia
    Gastro Acid
    Toxic
    Rest
    Sleep Talk
    Infestation (Yes, I know it's Special but base 20 is negligible damage)
    Substitute
    Barrier
    Curse
    Mirror Coat
    Recover
    Stealth Rock
    Pain Split
    Synthesis
    Swords Dance

    Offensive
    Energy Ball
    Solarbeam
    Earthquake
    Return
    Sludge Wave
    Sludge Bomb
    Stone Edge
    Giga Drain
    Seed Bomb
    Earth Power

  5. #5
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    Cradily is unusual in that its actually a specially defensive rock type - and for this reason, she loves to play in the sand, which boosts her special defense up by x 1.5 and by also supporting sandstorm teams by absorbing water attacks, getting a boost off it and countering said water types or destruction via passive damage.

    Cradily's best bet has to be in staller mode. All sets apart from the medicore attacking sets should have the item leftovers, max HP and recover. (base 81 attack is not that impressive, even with the boosting moves of curse/sword dance). Then either focus on on 252 EVs in Def or Sp.Def. Cradily only resists Normal and electric typed moves which are commonly both physical or electrical so its down to your personal preference. Remember, in the sand Cradily gains x 1.5 boost due to the rock typing so if you're using a sandstorm team, it might be more beneficial to pump the EVs in defense.

    So what other moves can Cradily use?

    Toxic is a key move. Cradily, as noted doesn't have the best offenses and toxic is a sure fire way to wear down a non-steel or poison typed opponent. With this in mind, Cradily's new toy, Infestations works well in trapping the unsuspecting pokemon so they can't escape and reset the poison counter and being cruel and evil and destroying the opponent in the most passive-aggressive way possible.

    Giga Drain is arguably the best STAB move Cradily's got going. Reasonable damage + healing side effect, perfect for stalling, plus works in tandem with its ability. Other viable moves for its Grass STAB include a gen-6 buffed Energy Ball or Seed bomb off its physical attacking Stat. Rock Slide is the only 'decent' rock attack it learns with the best balance of PP and power. However, it runs off Cradily's attacking stat which doesn't take advantage of potential x 1.5 special attacking boosts so Ancient power (for the ballsy) or Hidden Power Rock could be used. Hidden Power fire could be used to hit other grass and steel times super effectively but with no STAB and an uninvested special attacking stat, its unlikely to do much damage, except to those x 4 weak pokes like Scizor and Ferrothorn. Cradily has various other attacking options including poison type moves and ground attacks...but ask yourself this. Why?

    Support wise, Cradily can have Stealth Rocks bred on; always useful. Stockpile can aid in taking attacks and stalling for poison damage. Confuse Ray if you're feeling lucky.
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    Cradily. I love this thing. Tank-y and has recovery options out the wah and past the zoo. Plus, it is neutral to most of the common Weaknesses of Rock Types AND Grass Types.

    Stats:
    -HP - Good - Base 86 is a nice start for the tank-y aspect.
    -Attack - Slightly-Above Average - Base 81 could be better, but isn't too shabby.
    -Defense - Good-bordering-Great - Base 97 ups the tank factor.
    -Sp.Atk - Slightly-Above Average - Base 81 could be better, but isn't too shabby. Whoa...deja vu...
    -Sp.Def - Great - Base 107 solidifies Cradily's spot as a tank.
    -Speed - Good (Trick Room) - Base 43 is nice for Trick Room-based setup.

    Abilities:
    -Suction Cups - Cannot be forced out of Battle by an opponent's Moves. Nice, but pales in comparison to...
    -Storm Drain (Hidden, Available [Poké Transfer]) - Immunity to Water-Type Moves, draws Water-Type Moves towards it, and buffs Sp.Atk 1 stage when hit by a Water-Type Move. With so many Special options, why not?

    Overall, Cradily is hard to take down. Its Grass Type resists Ground and Water while its Rock Type resists Flying and Fire, balancing out its Types nicely. Giga Drain, Ingrain, Synthesis, Recover, and Pain Split give it many options for healing, Gastro Acid, Worry Seed, Toxic, Mirror Coat, Block, and Stealth Rock make it annoying, and a variety of mixed offense give it unpredictability. The only issue is that it lacks the raw power to outright KO an opponent. It can cause huge delays and cancellations in plans and be a bigger thorn in one's side than its Steel-Type cousin, Ferrothorn, but Cradily can't down an opponent with a single hit unless you get really, really, really lucky.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kraleck View Post
    Stats:
    -HP - Good - Base 86 is a nice start for the tank-y aspect.
    -Attack - Slightly-Above Average - Base 81 could be better, but isn't too shabby.
    -Defense - Good-bordering-Great - Base 97 ups the tank factor.
    -Sp.Atk - Slightly-Above Average - Base 81 could be better, but isn't too shabby. Whoa...deja vu...
    -Sp.Def - Great - Base 107 solidifies Cradily's spot as a tank.
    -Speed - Good (Trick Room) - Base 43 is nice for Trick Room-based setup.
    Although I agree with you for the most part, I think you're overestimating the HP stat. Base 86 isn't as great as you'd imagine - 49 HP subs aren't all too good, in fairness.

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    double and triple
    fossling all day and night

    -earth quake
    -Toxic/Sludge double and triple (fairy removal)
    -Synthesis / sandstorm / sunny day
    -stone edge / energy ball

    partners wall with flying/fire types.

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    Countering Cradily
    First things first, Cradily is weak to Fighting, and Ice attacks, which are very common. Steel and Bug are its other 2 weaknesses, while not as prominent, give an escape past its bulk. Cradily hates getting Toxic and Burned, because that also sabotages its bulk. Physical attacks are of vital importance in a sandstorm, where Cradily's already high SDEF skyrockets. As mentioned before, anything Cradily can't threaten can easily setup on it. Finally, Taunt puts the screws in the living fern big time, as it deprives Cradily of its recovery and its main method of dealing damage.
    I was once routed by a Gengar who critted 4 times in a row on my team. Morale of the story; Crits happen and Sucker Punch is good Gengar repellent.



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    I just want to point out that Cradily has beastly special defenses in sand storm. in a sandstorm team you could have something like this:


    ability:storm drain/suction cups
    moves:
    - recover/ingrain
    - giga drain/seed bomb
    - toxic
    - protect/rock slide/sub/ancient power
    EV: whatever bulky set
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    Quote Originally Posted by meganinja123456 View Post
    double and triple
    fossling all day and night

    -earth quake
    -Toxic/Sludge double and triple (fairy removal)
    -Synthesis / sandstorm / sunny day
    -stone edge / energy ball

    partners wall with flying/fire types.
    A. I think you mean Sludge Wave. Sludge is not a viable move on top of the fact that Cradily can't learn it
    B. Don't use Synthesis. Too many Tyranitars, Hippowodons and Politoeds lurking around + low PP. Recover is far more reliable.
    I was once routed by a Gengar who critted 4 times in a row on my team. Morale of the story; Crits happen and Sucker Punch is good Gengar repellent.



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    Oh Cradily, how much I love you. . .
    Although this set worked so well in GV with the Perma-weather this Gen it's not so bad either. In a Sandstorm this thing has way too much Special Defense, if this isn't any indication of how bulky it is, I don't know what else is.
    252+ SpA Adaptability Mega Lucario Aura Sphere vs. 252 HP / 168+ SpD Cradily in Sand: 204-240 (54.2 - 63.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
    (Provided you keep the EV spread I suggest)

    That's a mLuke fully invested in Special Attack hitting with a STAB move that is Adaptability boosted. . . Not too many things can live to tell that tale.
    Why you would ever bring a Cradily face to face with a mLuke I don't know, but that's besides the point.
    Well, that leaves one thing, its physical stats. Well, what'dya know, it just so happens to learn Curse, boosting it's two physical stats and lowering it's already abysmal speed making it able to not only take hits on both ends, but deal a bit of damage while it's around.


    Cursadily (Patent Pending)
    @ Leftovers
    Ability: Storm Drain/Suction Cups
    EVs: 252 HP / 88 Def / 168 SDef
    Careful Nature
    - Curse
    - Rock Slide
    - Seed Bomb/Earthquake
    - Recover

    Curse does as stated, boosting it's other stats to make it hit both sides as high as possible.
    It's dual STAB covers quite a bit of 'Mons being Resisted only by 34 Pokes. Or, you can trade off seed bomb for the ever popular Edge Quake combo. Recover gives you your health back to keep you around as long as possible. The ability is where the choice lies. Suction cups will of course keep you in as long as you like without the effects of Roar or Whirlwind ever ruining your chances of setting up in it's entirety. Where as Storm Drain is there for the rest of the team. It's a bit gimmicky, but it definitely works, just not as well as it did in GV.

    One could argue that the typical Stockpile set can work well (or better), and I'd agree to an extent, but it's entirely dependent on what Role Cradily plays. Typically it Toxic stalls, and it does it quite well, until that Steel type comes in and laughs as you switch out. Well, with this set not only can it take hits from both sides, but it can deal some damage in the process and heal up.

    Replay;
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    Last edited by MuhFugginMoose; 6th April 2014 at 6:45 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by CaptainSteve View Post
    Pros:
    - Decent enough defences (86/97/107) are okay enough to take a hit
    - Really nice supporting moves, which will be listed in the notable movepool
    - Pretty decent typing negates Grass' weakness to Fire and Flying and Rock's weakness to Water and Ground, all of which are pretty darn common this generation
    - Suction Cups mean that it can set up without fear of Roar, Whirlwind or Dragon Tail
    - 81/81 Offences are ech at best, but means that it can easily run Support, Offence or both at the same time, since the attacking movepool really isn't bad at all
    - It looks really cool
    - With the number of health recovery moves available to our ancient friend, base 86HP isn't bad, but a lack of Leech Seed will hinder this a little

    Cons:
    - Base 107 Special Defence is the best you can do
    - Still weak to Bug, Steel, Ice and Fighting, which are pretty common
    - Anything it cannot touch will set up
    - Storm Drain is okay at best on Cradily, whose SpDef and 1x will mean that most Water moves won't do too much anyway. Slight waste, in my opinion
    - Base 43 Defence. Good luck with that outside of Trick Room
    I think you mean it has base 43 speed. As not only is it's defence base 97, but also defence is not affected by trick room.




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    Quote Originally Posted by CaptainSteve View Post
    Although I agree with you for the most part, I think you're overestimating the HP stat. Base 86 isn't as great as you'd imagine - 49 HP subs aren't all too good, in fairness.
    What I meant is that Base 86 HP is better than Base 70, which I use as the Average mark for HP, but doesn't reach the zone of Base 90 to Base 119 that I label as Great. It's not a good Substitute user, but it's still taking a few hits before it drops. Plus, recovery options.
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    Cradily @ Leftovers
    Nature: Relaxed
    Ability: Storm Drain
    EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
    ~Stealth Rock
    ~Giga Drain
    ~Rock Slide / Toxic
    ~Recover

  16. #16
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    Now we're talking.

    I used this Cradily all the way through gen 5 - it was an invaluable asset against rain / sandstorm teams that swamped online wifi.
    Let's take a moment to remember how painful that was if you didn't pack an auto-weather inducer yourself.

    All my battles became that bit more enjoyable when I hatched this beaut:

    God Wall @ leftovers / sitrus berry (triples)
    Storm Drain
    3*144(HP,Def,Sp.def) 76 Sp.atk
    -Giga Drain
    -Ancient power
    -Stockpile
    -Recover

    Singles
    Toxic and crits are the only true enemies of this mighty beast once it reaches stockpile 3
    If your opponent had any water type,all you needed to do was switch it in.Non uber drizzle meant that switching into any water type spamming surf,hydro pump or waterfall was ridiculously easy.You get your storm drain boost,then your opponent either switches or fires a non STAB ice beam your way.Cradily being Cradily,shrugs it off and proceeds to stockpile,recovering if it needs to stay healthy.Offensively,mine uses giga drain(Bank only ) alongside ancient power.
    Why not earth power for killing steels?Several reasons.

    Cradily can take on ferrothorn and forretress very well as its speed neuters gyroball.Power whip on curse sets is inaccurate,and can be taken advantage of easily.Steelix and excadrill are hit weak by giga drain,but there are otherwise very few steels that Cradily can comfortably beat one on one.Earthpower's great for Heatran if it really bugs you,but...
    ...ancient power is just better.8PP is ample,has STAB and a much greater SE spectrum,smashing fire,flying,ice,and bug with great power.
    There's also that wonderful moment when the secondary effect triggers,and all of a sudden you're at +4 defences and +2 sp.attack with a reliable recovery move and your opponent graciously (*Rage quits*).

    Triples
    In triples it was absolutely brilliant.The consequences of player 1 three surf users spamming surf when Cradily's on the field is loss for player 1,end of story(and still is - weather is still viable in 6th gen triples).Give Cradily a corner late game to set up,and you're sorted for any autocentres.

    Things Cradily kills/is killed by in gen 6:

    As stated,Cradily is amazing if you have issues with water types.That said,popular ones such as Rotom W Azumarill and mega gyra have Voltswitch,superpower and mold breaker respectively,the former is easily switched out to a counter,the latter two can be hard to dispose without a defence boost.
    Electric types also have a very hard time even with an appropriate hidden power because of its bulk.Flying types without fighting type coverage,fire types full stop.Ground types.Cradily can set up and wall 'em all.

    Basically,what you need to do to stop the set is to not give it an opportunity to set up,else set up yourself.Scizor remains very common,and whilst Cradily can deal decent damage on it with Ancient power it's easy set up bait against it.Dragonite -now weakness policy exists(why...)can now take Cradily on knowing that at the end of the day all it needs is at least +3 Atk Outrage to push through it.
    Talonflame can 2HKO,but is OHKO'd in return by Ancient power.STAB ice(especially blizzard),fighting types,taunt...you get the picture.

    Whilst not the most practical in gen 6 battlespot nowadays,it is still one of my favourite walls that ruins most things revolving round weather without running weather yourself.

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    Ah one of the more interesting fossil pokemon and probably the one that benefits the most defensively from sandstorm. I used one with storm drain in gen 5 on my sandstorm team and I liked it... Sadly gen 6 has crippled it by removing not only permanent weather, but the moves Cradily needs to compete (namely Giga Drain... yeah deny it Giga drain but let it learn mega drain... really?)

    as all the real options have been covered, (saddly they keep this guys options quite limited )the best I can share is a little trivia, The Cradily line are the only fossils based on an animal line that is is not extinct; in this case the Crinoids who still live deep in the ocean as they have since the early paleozoic and are well known for their fossils
    hope some of this can help
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    Know what's hilarious? Throw this at the end of a baton pass line. Yes, Magic Bounce Pokemon are probably more useful, but Suction Cups means you can't be switched out and if you can get your stats boosted high enough, you can really ruin teams behind a substitute. Of course, you'll need to avoid Toxic. Since this is special, Skarmory's a good partner. Cradily can use Earthquake while Skarmory can phase out threats, and of course they'll work under sand. In that case, you'll want Storm Drain, since Surf exists (and too many people forget about that ability, including me...while a special attack boost is nice and all, I'd much prefer actually attacking my opponent sometimes).
    Last edited by Electrolled; 11th April 2014 at 5:30 AM.

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    I think Cradily should work for physical offense if you want him to be an attacker. I mean, he can use Swords Dance and Curse yet there's no way he can boost his Special Attack, except for Storm Drain and Ancient Power.

    I think the only way to make sure he can be a special powerhouse is to have a partner who will use surf continuously for six turns. But I think it's just a waste of time. :3

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    My preferred move set for Cradily are RECOVER, TOXIC, CURSE and STONE EDGE (for support) or SWORDS DANCE/CURSE, RECOVER, EARTHQUAKE/STONE EDGE and SEED BOMB for offensive set.

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    Stats
    Cradily is fairly good, for the bulky uses. 81 base Atk and SpAtk each is very useful, especially as Cradily's typing screams 'MIXED SET' at me. 97 base Def and 107 base SpDef show it off as a wall, but it is let down by the 86 base HP. The Spd? Abysmal. 43 base stat is poor, by anything's standards.

    Movepool
    Defensively, Cradily gets Toxic, Stealth Rock, Curse, Recover, Synthesis, Barrier, Stockpile, Amnesia, Ingrain and dual screens, which basically reinforces that it is defensive. Three self-healing moves? This guy is designed for the long haul. Physically, Cradily gets Earthquake, Bulldoze, Stone Edge, Rock Slide, Seed Bomb, Bullet Seed, Secret Power and Headbutt. Not brilliant, really. Only about four really viable options, in Seed Bomb, EQ, Rock Slide and Stone Edge. In the special moves department, however, it gets access to Giga Drain, Earth Power, Energy Ball, Ancient Power, Sludge Wave/Bomb, and Solar Beam. Fairly useful, but not overly powerful, aside from Earth Power, Energy Ball and Solar Beam.

    Abilities
    Suction Cups is fairly useless, as it just prevents Cradily from being forcibly switched, which Ingrain does anyway. It's HA, Storm Drain, is much better, as it can benefit from dealing with Azumarills, and Surf boosts in Doubles/Triples.

    Sets
    Cradily@Light Clay
    Storm Drain
    Adamant
    -Reflect
    -Stealth Rock
    -Light Screen
    -Stone Edge/Rock Slide

    Simple set, if Cradily is your lead. Set up both screens and SR, then Stone Edge/Rock Slide whatever faces you till you're KOed. I advise Rock Slide/Stone Edge over Seed Bomb in this set so you aren't walled by a Sap Sipper.

    Cradily@Big Root/Leftovers (If you don't run Giga Drain)
    Storm Drain
    Modest
    252 HP, 252 SpAtk, 4 Def
    -Giga Drain/Energy Ball
    -Ancient Power
    -Sludge Wave/Bomb
    -Earth Power/Recover

    This is the alternative set for a bulky Cradily. It can naturally take some hits, and the Leftovers/Big Root + Giga Drain can keep you in there for a while, with Recover an option if you don't get Giga Drain or Earth Power for gen V. The rest of the set enables some serious Special-based damage in the long run against anything not named Blissey or Eviolite Chansey.

    Doubles/Triples
    Cradily is interesting here as a partner for anything weak to Water due to Storm Drain and the usage of Surf, especially Talonflame, who covers all its weaknesses. It also can pack EQ, making it a viable attacker, with dual screen support and SR.

    Countering Cradily
    It's weak to Bug, Ice, Steel and Fighting. Impressive, for a combination of two types with five weaknesses each. So, yeah. Physical Fighting/Steel type moves are better, as it has less Def then SpDef. X-Scissor and Ice Punch will deal serious hurts, too. Mega Scizor/Lucario hit it hard, but nothing really can fully be said to resist anything Cradily throws at it in theory, as Grass/Poison/Rock/Ground hit for neutral coverage against everything in the game. The best thing to do is outspeed it and take a hit or two, as it takes a lot to OHKO Cradily.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Red_raselom View Post
    I think Cradily should work for physical offense if you want him to be an attacker. I mean, he can use Swords Dance and Curse yet there's no way he can boost his Special Attack, except for Storm Drain and Ancient Power.

    I think the only way to make sure he can be a special powerhouse is to have a partner who will use surf continuously for six turns. But I think it's just a waste of time. :3
    Water is really common however,and after a defence boost,getting at least one boost from ancient power on top of storm drain grants it a great deal of power for a wall as good as this,two boosts or one.
    Special sets have much less problems with rock,flying and steel(when damage is necessary) as they naturally tend to high physical defence,low special defence.It's also where the EVs tend to go on their defensive sets,perhaps because earthquake and rock slide exist.
    Physical sets set up faster,agreed,but to say anything special is useless without +6 boosts is very far from the truth!

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    Suction Cups w/ Leftovers
    Relaxed w/ 252 Defense, 252 S. Defense, 6 HP
    Ancientpower
    Energy Ball
    Sludge Bomb
    Gastro Acid/Hidden Power [Fire]

    Countering
    Pokemon with Ice/Fighting/Bug/Ice-Type moves (maybe Physical) like Ice Punch Dusknoir, Scrafty, Sniper Kingdra, Evolite Porygon2, Escavaleir, Megahorn Bouffalant, Flash Cannon Magnezone, Hydreigon, Druddigon, Metagross, Ferrothorn, Hitmontop, or Focus Blast Dragalge.
    Got Pokémon X. Intend to get either Omega Ruby or Alpha Sapphire.
    No info about my Friend Safari.
    Vivillon Pattern: Polar
    Looking for nicknamed, shiny, and/or have a hidden ability in GTS and may battle at anytime.
    If interested, send a private message with your ID #.

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