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Thread: Community POTW #132

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    Default Community POTW #132

    Time for the next Pokémon, and this week we have another legendary Pokémon



    It's Entei, the Fire-type beast from Johto. It's capable of quite a lot, especially now it gets Sacred Fire

    Go nuts

    http://www.serebii.net/pokedex-xy/244.shtml

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    Until recently Entei was a useful but not a special pokemon, it has an excellent 115 physical attack and none of its stats are really bad. However it needs a little push to be a great wallbreaker. Its also not particularly fast at base 100. Its best as a physical attacker but hasn't got much of a physical movepool either, compared to Darmanitan and Infernape. It also has solid defences for a fire type, but unlike arcanine it lacks recovery outside of rest and doesn't have intimidate making it outclassed as a wall by arcanine. This is a shame as entei has lots of nice stall moves such as reflect and roar.

    The main niche it has is that it in X and Y entei became the only non-uber user of the excellent Sacred Fire, which is almost 100% accurate and burns more often than flare blitz without recoil damage. This along with bulldoze in Gen V and stone edge in gen IV has made entei steadily more useful since the physical special split in Gen IV.

    Entei's limited movepool is its greatest weakness, as it is walled easily by bulky waters such as crocune and mega swampert, although entei can also often burn them with sacred fire or cut their speed with bulldoze. Mega Ampharos, snorlax and cresselia can also take hits well and force a switch. Chesnaught can use spiky shield to check what move banded entei is locked into before switching

    Release the Hound! (UU singles)
    Ability: Pressure
    Item: Choice Band
    -Sacred Fire
    - Stone Edge
    - Bulldoze/Iron Tail
    - Extreme Speed
    Adamant Nature
    252 ATK, 252 Speed, 4 Defence


    Other options include roar, HP grass, solar beam and snarl.
    Last edited by Aduro; 2nd May 2016 at 11:15 PM.

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    Another option to consider is Flame Plate to bluff a Choice Item while retaining a powerful Sacred Fire, but ESpeed will be much weaker and you'll have a worse cleaner.
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    Entei was always one of my favorite things about Gen II. It was a legendary, it was a fire type, and it was the focus of the third movie. Since then Entei has had some trouble setting itself apart; it has a good stat spread and movepool, but before XY, its stats and movepool were remarkably similar to Arcanine, which since Gen III has had access to better abilities. In Gen VI, though, the game has changed; access to Sacred Fire is one shining new asset. Now Entei has more viability even in higher formats. Entei still has some issues; its speed is good but not great, that Special Attack and special movepool are just short of passable, and of course, Entei's Hidden Ability is still not available, which is frustrating. But overall Entei can be good in a tight situation, due to it having a few good sets and some decent versatility. Here's a BSS set I've had success with:

    Burnin' Ring of Fire
    Item: Assault Vest / Leftovers
    EVs/Nature: 232 HP / 252 Atk / 20 Spe, Adamant
    Ability: Pressure
    - Sacred Fire
    - Bulldoze
    - Stone Edge
    - Flame Charge / Extremespeed

    This set is fairly easy to use. Entei has a nice 115 base HP, which paired with 232 EVs and an Assault Vest, makes for a very bulky Pokemon. 90% of the time, use Assault Vest here; Entei appreciates the bulk more than healing, and its boosting movepool isn't really worth considering on this set. The 20 speed EVs allow you to outpace any base 115 speed stats after a Flame Charge or Bulldoze, giving enemies like Mega Lucario reason to be afraid. The moves are the easy part; Sacred Fire is your favorite STAB, the pseudo-QuakeEdge combo gives you great coverage and handles Fire-types that resist Sacred Fire, such as Heatran and Talonflame, and in the last moveslot, Flame Charge boosts your speed to terrifying levels or Extremespeed gives you excellent priority. Note that if you choose to forego Flame Charge, you'll only have Bulldoze left for general speed control. Leftovers are another option here, but they work better on Pressure stalling sets that you don't see much of really.
    Last edited by generic villager #5; 1st May 2016 at 10:38 PM. Reason: Entei doesn't get EQ.
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    @ Generic Villager
    Entei doesn't get Earthquake.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Swoobat View Post
    Another option to consider is Flame Plate to bluff a Choice Item while retaining a powerful Sacred Fire, but ESpeed will be much weaker and you'll have a worse cleaner.
    That wouldn't work due to Entei never running Scarf, which is the common bluffing item. Besides, the damage output on Sacred Fire would give it away, and they might just assume you have AV if they see a less powerful E-Speed.

    It's still a valid choice, just not for bluffing.
    Last edited by Karxrida; 1st May 2016 at 9:38 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by mtndrew24
    spoiler ansem isnt ansem but is actually pretending to be ansem as riku inside ansem pretending to be ansem

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    Entei is not a Pokemon I would recommend for VGC 2016. The main reason to use it, Sacred Fire, is completely nullified by Primordial Sea (while Will-O-Wisp, a move many of Entei's competitors feature, can still be used), and the premier threat in the format, P-Groudon, can't be burned. Entei does still fill a solid role in Battle Spot Doubles, just like it did in VGC 2015.

    Entei is really hurt in VGC by the Pentagon-only rule, as it loses out on Extreme Speed, but it already faces stiff competition from other fire types, especially Arcanine, who has a much better ability, better recovery, and similar stats (while again, still being able to burn things in heavy rain if you play under this year's rules). Entei's niche as the only non-restricted Pokemon to have Sacred Fire, however, still makes it a viable option.

    Entei @ Leftovers
    Ability: Pressure
    Level: 50
    EVs: 236 HP / 252 Atk / 20 Spe
    Adamant Nature
    - Sacred Fire
    - Stone Edge
    - Protect
    - Iron Head/Bulldoze/Snarl/Substitute

    Max attack with an Adamant nature maximizes Sacred Fire's power. 20 speed EVs were chosen to outspeed Bisharp and KO it (or KO and hopefully burn it if it has a Focus Sash), but more speed can be invested to outspeed things like the less common Breloom. Entei does have base 100 speed, so a Jolly nature with max speed can be chosen if you want, but you'll be flipping a coin to outspeed threats like max speed M-Kangaskhan (and then flipping another coin that you even get the burn). Stone Edge provides coverage, especially against Charizard and Talonflame, and Protect is Protect. Iron Head and Bulldoze can give additional coverage against fairies or things like Heatran, and Bulldoze can also help provide speed control against things on the ground. Snarl and Substitute work well with Entei's bulk, and Leftovers further increases this bulk, but items like Assault Vest, Sitrus Berry, Safety Goggles, etc. are nice alternatives depending on what your team needs.
    Last edited by EKZ1505; 1st May 2016 at 10:08 PM.
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  8. #8

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    Quote Originally Posted by Aduro View Post
    @ Generic Villager
    Entei doesn't get Earthquake.
    Well, don't I feel silly now.

    I've only actually used the Bulldoze/Extremespeed set so far, I forgot it doesn't get EQ. But that's because I wanted bulk+priority/speed control to make up for holes in a hyper offense team. I'll edit my post. thanks for the catch.
    The risk I took was calculated, but man, am I bad at math.

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    So the new battle competition for the end of this month could see a good Entei as a useful mon. Its gen 1&2 with no megas with no sleep clause so Spore Smeargles and bulky Scizors are probably going to be everywhere. Entei and Arcanines will probably be the only viable fire types and the best chance to OHKO scizor. I'm thinking sub + 3 attacks Entei or sub calm mind could be useful.

    Here's a set for the Johto Open Competition at the end of the month.

    Voiced By Dan Green!
    Entei @ Flame Plate
    Ability: Pressure
    Level: 50
    EVs: 108 HP / 244 Atk / 156 Spe
    Adamant Nature
    - Substitute
    - Sacred Fire
    - Extreme Speed
    - Stone Edge

    The EVs here seem a bit dodgy but they're carefully calculated. 156 speed is faster than jolly 252 speed EV Smeargle so it Entei can use substitute before it spores. This Entei can also outspeed magnetons, politoeds and other base 70 speed pokemon. This build only speed ties with max speed timid nidoqueens and is outsped by max speed jolly Feraligatr so be careful. 108 HP gives Entei enough HP for 51 HP substitutes so the subs can survive seismic tosses from walls like Chansey at level 50. The other 240 EVs are in physical attack so Entei still functions as a physical threat.

    Sacred Fire is the main attacking move over flare blitz so Entei doesn't take recoil and can use its subs, and the 50% burn chance is also great. extreme speed helps Entei clean up and could be useful against aqua jet azumarill or mach punch machamp or really any priority users late game. Stone edge seems to be a solid choice for coverage for Entei, but it could be replaced depending on what threats emerge in this new metagame. Obviously choice band doesn't mix with substitute so flame plate and charcoal are good ways for Entei to hit harder with its main STAB without taking life orb damage.
    Last edited by Aduro; 2nd May 2016 at 11:52 PM.

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    Well, what does that "Crocune" term mean? It's a really technical word thrown around i UU. But it's weird word.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jireh the provider View Post
    Well, what does that "Crocune" term mean? It's a really technical word thrown around i UU. But it's weird word.
    Its a suicune set that usually uses rest, sleep talk, calm mind and scald and holds leftovers with a lot of defence. Its a simple and predictable build, but its also capable of burning with scald, healing most statuses and its HP with rest and is quite difficult to take down before it gets several special attack and special defence boosts (which makes it a real problem for Entei). If you've played a lot of UU you've probably battled a few teams with crocune.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Aduro View Post
    Entei and Arcanines will probably be the only viable fire types
    Nah, I'd argue Houndoom has a chance, along with Moltres. Heck, even Drought Ninetales could work with Chlorophyll Exeggutor/Victreebel/Venusaur.

    So this isn't a completely useless post, I'm just gonna say that AV is OO at best on Entei, imho. Entei is a wallbreaker, not a tank, and AV doesn't really let you survive much that you wouldn't anyway (especially in UU)- you need SDef invesment to survive powerful Water attacks (which cuts into your wallbreaking prowess), and a weakness to Stealth Rock means that you have to be pretty consistent with hazard control for it to work. Smogon's analysis has it listed under OOs, so it's probably semi-viable, just not an optimal choice in comparison to Band/Flame Plate.

    EDIT: AV is good on Battle Spot and other 3v3 environments, however, due to the extreme rarity of hazards.
    Last edited by The Umbreon Tamer; 3rd May 2016 at 4:34 PM.

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    There's been a surprising lack of mention of Flare Blitz in this thread. Contrary to what some may think, Sacred Fire did not render Flare Blitz obsolete. In fact, most sets run both Sacred Fire and Flare Blitz. Sacred Fire's dastardly 50% burn rate may be great and make it spammable in the sense that few things want to switch into it, but with its low PP, you can only use it so many times, and pressure users such as Suicune can chip away at it if you're not careful. Flare Blitz helps pick up the slack by having substantially more PP, and it's superior power can help out quite a bit, especially after you've already burned key threats or are cleaning up late-game. Sure, the recoil can be a downer at times, but it does have its niche, enough to make it one of Entei's most common moves in spite of Sacred Fire.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aduro View Post
    So the new battle competition for the end of this month could see a good Entei as a useful mon. Its gen 1&2 with no megas with no sleep clause so Spore Smeargles and bulky Scizors are probably going to be everywhere. Entei and Arcanines will probably be the only viable fire types and the best chance to OHKO scizor. I'm thinking sub + 3 attacks Entei or sub calm mind could be useful.

    Here's a set for the Johto Open Competition at the end of the month.

    Voiced By Dan Green!
    Entei @ Flame Plate
    Ability: Pressure
    Level: 50
    EVs: 108 HP / 244 Atk / 156 Spe
    Adamant Nature
    - Substitute
    - Sacred Fire
    - Extreme Speed
    - Stone Edge

    The EVs here seem a bit dodgy but they're carefully calculated. 156 speed is faster than jolly 252 speed EV Smeargle so it Entei can use substitute before it spores. This Entei can also outspeed magnetons, politoeds and other base 70 speed pokemon. This build only speed ties with max speed timid nidoqueens and is outsped by max speed jolly Feraligatr so be careful. 108 HP gives Entei enough HP for 51 HP substitutes so the subs can survive seismic tosses from walls like Chansey at level 50. The other 240 EVs are in physical attack so Entei still functions as a physical threat.

    Sacred Fire is the main attacking move over flare blitz so Entei doesn't take recoil and can use its subs, and the 50% burn chance is also great. extreme speed helps Entei clean up and could be useful against aqua jet azumarill or mach punch machamp or really any priority users late game. Stone edge seems to be a solid choice for coverage for Entei, but it could be replaced depending on what threats emerge in this new metagame. Obviously choice band doesn't mix with substitute so flame plate and charcoal are good ways for Entei to hit harder with its main STAB without taking life orb damage.
    Have we ever made sets for specific competitions like this? I don't think it's necessary since it's a temporary format. Also, is E-Speed even legal in that format?

    Quote Originally Posted by KillerDraco View Post
    There's been a surprising lack of mention of Flare Blitz in this thread. Contrary to what some may think, Sacred Fire did not render Flare Blitz obsolete. In fact, most sets run both Sacred Fire and Flare Blitz. Sacred Fire's dastardly 50% burn rate may be great and make it spammable in the sense that few things want to switch into it, but with its low PP, you can only use it so many times, and pressure users such as Suicune can chip away at it if you're not careful. Flare Blitz helps pick up the slack by having substantially more PP, and it's superior power can help out quite a bit, especially after you've already burned key threats or are cleaning up late-game. Sure, the recoil can be a downer at times, but it does have its niche, enough to make it one of Entei's most common moves in spite of Sacred Fire.
    Entei can't run it in OU because it needs Stone Edge for other Fires, and forgoing Bulldoze to get walled by Heatran is a travesty.

    The set should slash it with Bulldoze and mention that it's preferred in UU, while in OU it's not necessary due to the lack of ubiquitous Pressure users. And you really need to hit Heatran.
    Quote Originally Posted by mtndrew24
    spoiler ansem isnt ansem but is actually pretending to be ansem as riku inside ansem pretending to be ansem

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    Quote Originally Posted by Karxrida View Post
    Entei can't run it in OU because it needs Stone Edge for other Fires, and forgoing Bulldoze to get walled by Heatran is a travesty.

    The set should slash it with Bulldoze and mention that it's preferred in UU, while in OU it's not necessary due to the lack of ubiquitous Pressure users. And you really need to hit Heatran.
    Yeah but Entei in OU isn't exactly winning any awards. Most of the talk pertaining to Entei should be centered around UU, since it's a fantastic, just-shy-of-top-tier threat in UU, whereas it's a niche choice in OU.
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    Quote Originally Posted by KillerDraco View Post
    Yeah but Entei in OU isn't exactly winning any awards. Most of the talk pertaining to Entei should be centered around UU, since it's a fantastic, just-shy-of-top-tier threat in UU, whereas it's a niche choice in OU.
    Yeah I know, but viable is viable, even if it's kind of niche. Probably should have clarified that bit.
    Quote Originally Posted by mtndrew24
    spoiler ansem isnt ansem but is actually pretending to be ansem as riku inside ansem pretending to be ansem

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    Quote Originally Posted by Karxrida View Post
    Have we ever made sets for specific competitions like this? I don't think it's necessary since it's a temporary format. Also, is E-Speed even legal in that format?
    The rules just say posts have to be relevant to competitive pokemon and people posting sets should name the format. I figured i'd mention it because Entei will likely be getting some usage in that competition and people might want to know a nice set. Also, no pentagons needed so e-speed should be fine.
    Last edited by Aduro; 3rd May 2016 at 5:52 PM.

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